The e-seminar on  "The Bio-Conversion of Putrescent Wastes" will be
presented by Dr. Paul A. Olivier (President, Engineering, Separation &
Recycling LLC, Washington, Louisiana, USA). He will be available to
respond to your questions between 01 and 13 March.

The background material for the discussion is already available. Please
take a look at the html file at http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm
or if you wish to download and/or print it out, it is also available as
a pdf file (1,2 mb) at http://www.biotech.kth.se/iobb/news/po-brazil.pdf

The chairperson of the e-seminar is Dr Larry Newton (Animal & Dairy
Science Dept., University of Georgia Coastal Plain Station, Tifton, USA)
and on  the 1st of March, he will welcome Dr. Paul Olivier and open the
e-seminar for discussion.

Before that and as a pre-seminar activity, you are now welcome to
introduce yourself and elaborate your work if it concerns the conversion
of putrescent wastes using insect larvae or worms.

Regards
Jacky Foo
Listowner

>>> Posting number 96
Date:         Sat, 28 Feb 2004 11:56:48 +0100
Subject:      INTRO -  Jacky Foo (SE)
From:        Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

I worked with insect larvae as chicken feed in Western Samoa (2000-2002)
and produced them with brewery spent grains with yeast as the
attractant. Larvae were mostly housefly larvae but I think there were a
few larvae of black soldier fly too. The exposure of the substrate to
flies was 3-4 days before use and therefore did not have enough time for
BSF larvae to be noticed. Substrate and feed residues were buried into
the ground to attract and grow earthworms.

I run a crude vermiculture heap at home for several years now and bury
all garden biomass into the ground (same spot). I get lots and fat
earthworms as fish bait.

Paul Olivier's work has interest me greatly and before April, I hope to
develop a research proposal with a partner in a developing country.
Countries that generate a lot of peelings such as banana peels and wet
irish potato peelings as in Uganda should be an ideal place to have a
project. Banana peels are sometimes collected as cattle feed. What is
interesting with BSF/earthworm is that a cultivation unit can be
operated with small amounts of food residues from a household kitchen.

But why then has this practice or hobby not common in most countries ! I
hope that during the e-seminar, we will be able to discuss and look into
factors influencing this and also get suggestions on how to encourage
and make changes.

Jacky Foo
Dept of Biotechnology,
Royal Inst of Technology, Stockholm.

>>> Posting number 3
Date:         Sat, 28 Feb 2004 12:02:20 +0100
Subject:      INTRO - Robin Ansell (CA)
From:         "R. Ansell" <svorca@shaw.ca>

Hi

My name is Robin Ansell. I am a retired power plant engineer. Having
given up the globe trotting hurly-burly of building power stations
around the world I now run a small farm in partnership with my wife,
producing naturally raised eggs, chickens, ducks, pork and beef which we
direct market to our customers in Port Alberni, British Columbia,
Canada. We have also had some intermittent success with forest grown
specialty mushrooms.

Currently we use natural worm composting for waste recycling, however if
BSF are cold hardy (with a little help) then it opens up the possibility
of processing other waste streams - local dairy farm effluent (suitably
dewatered), restaurant and bakery wastes etc. which tend to be
ineffectively utilised because of the unpredictability of the volumes available.

I am looking forward to a lively discussion session on Dr. Paul
Olivier's excellent presentation.

Best regards
Robin Ansell

>>> Posting number 4
Date:         Sun, 29 Feb 2004 06:12:14 +0100
Subject:      INTRO - Mary Appelhof (USA)
From:         Mary Appelhof <mappelho@tds.net>

I have been using redworms (Eisenia fetida) to process my kitchen wastes
for over 30 years and wrote the book, "Worms Eat My Garbage: How to set
up and maintain a worm composting system" that has sold over 165,000
copies since its first publication in 1982 (revised in 1997).

I participated in the first BSF internet seminar and was fascinated with
a creature that can consume 95% of raw food wastes in a 24 hour period.
We occasionally get BSF larvae in our worm shipments from Georgia, but
here in Michigan we don't seem to have them in the wild. I would love to
have a methodology that could utilize BSF larvae for humanure during a
1-2 week vacation period during July-August on a northern Michigan
island with a primitive camp site.

Would it be possible to bring a few paper cards  inoculated with several
thousand eggs, place them in the receptables that Paul shows, and use
them for toilets in a camping situation? Would the eggs hatch and larvae
go right to work?

I can see advantages of BSF over worms, but I can also see challenges in
colder climates such as ours. I will be very much interested in seeing
discussions of combining the two (BSF larvae and worms) in integrated
systems that reduce volumes quickly, but also produce worm castings as a
product. I would think the volume of castings produced would be very
minimal.

Mary Appelhof
--
Mary Appelhof, Author of "Worms Eat My Garbage"
Flowerfield Enterprises,10332 Shaver Road,Kalamazoo, MI 49024 USA
  PH:269-327-0108  FAX 269-327-7009
"Changing the way the world thinks about garbage"
Subscribe to my WormEzine at: http://www.wormwoman.com
or download archives in PDF format.

>>> Posting number 5
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:29:44 +0100
Subject:      Welcome and opening of e-seminar
From: Larry Newton [fig@tifton.uga.edu]

Greetings and Welcome to the IOBB e-seminar, The Bioconversion of
Putrescent Wastes.

The background material has been prepared by Dr. Paul A. Olivier, who is
our presenter. If you have not already done so, please review the
background presentation at http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm . We
are fortunate to have Dr. Olivier, President of Engineering, Separation
& Recycling, LLC, and an accomplished professional in several fields of
recycling ,  as our presenter.

 The conversion of spoiled and discarded putrescent materials to usable
material in an environmentally friendly manner can be a challenge; to
also achieve economical viability has been even more challenging. Such
materials naturally undergo decomposition by various biological agents.
This seminar will focus on harnessing one of these biological agents in
a recycling system that holds promise of being an economically
attractive and environmentally superior technology.

Please feel free to comment or address questions at any time.
We appreciate your interest,

Chairman of IOBB e-seminar
Larry Newton
Animal & Dairy Science Dept.,
University of Georgia Coastal Plain Station,
Tifton, GA. USA

>>> Posting number 6
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:48:29 +0100
Subject:      Marketing turnkey systems
From:       "Gary Breitenbeck" <gbreitenbeck@agctr.lsu.edu>

Paul:
Look over your site again and thought I pass along a couple of additional thoughts.

Have you considered marketing turnkey systems (like the catfish
processing wastes to catfish feed) rather than pushing the individual units ?

I believe you experimented with processing chicken manure to chicken
feed as well. This would seem to be an easier sell.

--gb
Louisiana State University
Agronomy Department
LSU Cooperative Extension Service-AG Center

>>> Posting number 7
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:50:49 +0100
Subject:      insect repellents and biostatic compounds
From: "Gary Breitenbeck" <gbreitenbeck@agctr.lsu.edu>

Paul:

The suggestion that the larvae produce byproducts such as insect repellents is interesting.

Are the larvae bacteriovres or are they eating the wastes themselves?

If they digest the wastes directly, do they produce biostatic compounds
to inhibit decay and odors?

--gb
Louisiana State University
LSU Agronomy Department

>>> Posting number 8
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 06:57:15 +0100
Subject:      Wastes found in warm countries
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo wrote:
>Paul Olivier's work has interested me greatly and before April,
>I hope to develop a research proposal with a partner in a
>developing country. Countries that generate a lot of peelings
>such as banana peels and wet irish potato peelings as in
>Uganda should be an ideal place to have a project.
>Banana peels are sometimes collected as cattle feed.

Banana and Irish potato peelings prove to be an ideal food for BSF
larvae. The moisture content of such waste is relatively low, and
therefore its digestion by the larvae should not release free liquids
into the disposal unit. Since the cellulose content of such waste is
also very low, the amount of outgoing BSF residue should be minimal.
There should be no need to grind or process the incoming waste or the
outgoing residue.

The tropical climate of a country such as Uganda should enable wild
adults to furnish eggs without any interruption. Special care should be
taken to assure that the disposal units do not overheat in view of the
high density of larvae required for rapid digestion. Special precautions
against the intrusion of ants should be taken.

This should be a very interesting project.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
519 West Dejean Street
Washington, Louisiana 70589

Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm
http://www.biotech.kth.se/iobb/news/e-sem-03.html
 

>>> Posting number 9
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:53:06 +0100
Subject:      combining BSF larvae and worms
From:      "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Mary Appelhof wrote:
>I can see advantages of BSF over worms, but I can also see
>challenges in colder climates such as ours. I will be very
>much interested in seeing discussions of combining the two
>(BSF larvae and worms) in integrated systems that reduce
>volumes quickly, but also produce worm castings as a product.
>I would think the volume of castings produced would be very minimal.

One might attempt to grow worms and larvae in the same BSF bioconversion
unit, or one might empty out the BSF unit and deposit its residue in a
totally separate and independent worm bin. Worms bins in California and
Oregon are generally infested with BSF larvae, but since BSF prepupae
have no way of exiting these worm bin, they easily die in this putrescent mix.

I am a strong believer that BSF larvae and redworms are fully
complementary in the task of disposing of putrescent waste: one does
what the other cannot do. BSF larvae do a great job on fresh putrescent
waste, and redworms do a great job in converting high cellulosic BSF
residue into castings. The total reduction in weight and volume
resulting from this combined bioconversion would be extraordinary.

But it is not clear to me what would be the better approach, to grow
them within the same bin or to grow them in separate bins. Prof. Tran
Tan Viet in Vietnam has had great success in raising redworms on BSF
residue, but I suppose that this was done in separate bins. Both
creatures have different life cycle requirements, and it may prove
easier to grow them in separate bins.

We know that BSF larvae do quite well in worm bins, but we do not know
if worms would do well in the average BSF bin. BSF larvae generally
thrive under conditions that redworms could never tolerate. In any case,
one would have to make considerable changes to the preparation and
introduction of food waste into a BSF bin if this same bin were to
support a colony of redworms.

Thanks.
Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
519 West Dejean Street
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540

>>> Posting number 10
Date:         Mon, 1 Mar 2004 07:53:06 +0100
Subject:      BSF in camping sites
From:       "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Mary Appelhof wrote:
>I would love to have a methodology that could utilize
>BSF larvae for humanure during a 1-2 week vacation period
>during July-August on a northern Michigan island
>with a primitive camp site.
>
>Would it be possible to bring a few paper cards  inoculated
>with several thousand eggs, place them in the receptables
>that Paul shows, and use them for toilets in a camping situation?
>Would the eggs hatch and larvae go right to work?

Dr. Craig Sheppard has had notable success in handling and shipping BSF
eggs, although one might suppose that newly hatched BSF larvae might be
somewhat easier to handle and ship. BSF larvae do a great job on human
feces, but less so if urine is present. Therefore the urine-diverting
toilet is ideal. As soon as feces is deposited into a BSF unit, it is
digested with a matter of hours, and the smell associated with feces is
quickly eliminated.

Thanks.

Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Washington, Louisiana 70589
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 11
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:26:56 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From:       "R. Ansell" <svorca@shaw.ca>

Paul

As many waste streams that could be utilised for larvae feed are often
sporadic in availability and quantity, is there any minimum criterion
for daily "fresh" feed that must be observed to ensure a healthy population?

Best regards
Robin Ansell

>>> Posting number 12
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 08:26:56 +0100
Subject:      INTRO - Cornelius A. Van Milligen (USA)
From:       CAVM@aol.com

I am president of Kentucky Enrichment Inc.  We are a project management
company and heavily involved in composting and alternative agriculture.
We were participants in the first BSF seminar.

KEI has put on a vermicomposting seminar, Mary Appelhoff was a
presenter.  We are cooperating with Dr. Sheppard in the promotion of BSF
technology as a waste processing option.

KEI is investigating the use of holograms as a light transmission option
to keep BSF adults breeding 12 months per year.  We also have an alternative
heating option to keep the larvae warm using used motor oil as fuel for a boiler.

Cornelius A. Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc.
www.kentuckyenrichment.com

>>> Posting number 13
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:30:38 +0100
Subject:      Marketing turnkey systems
From:       Paul Olivier [xpolivier@hotmail.com]

Gary Breitenbeck asked:
>Have you considered marketing turnkey systems (like
>the catfish processing wastes to catfish feed) rather than
>pushing the individual units ? I believe you experimented
>with processing chicken manure to chicken feed as well.
>This would seem to be an easier sell.

Yes, with BSF larvae, we can process catfish waste and chicken waste
and, at the same time, produce catfish and chicken feed respectively. My
young son, Robert, with a degree in environmental science and business,
is far more interested in marketing turnkey systems as you suggest. But
my immediate inclination is to design and manufacture recycling
equipment, and this bioconversion process is only a small part of a
total recycling concept that I am developing to process automobile,
industrial and municipal waste. So my hands are full, and I welcome the
opportunity to help the people who actually recycle and put forward a
turnkey solution.

Thanks.
Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 14
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:36:30 +0100
Subject:      insect repellents and biostatic compounds
From:       Paul Olivier [xpolivier@hotmail.com]

Gary Breitenbeck wrote:
>The suggestion that the larvae produce byproducts such
>as insect repellents is interesting.

This was one of the first aspects of BSF bioconversion that Dr. Craig
Sheppard studied back in the 1970's.

>Are the larvae bacteriovores or are the eating the wastes themselves?
>If they digest the wastes directly, do they produce biostatic
>compounds to inhibit decay and odors?

In general it is safe to say that BSF larvae feed on fresh waste within
minutes of it being deposited into the unit, long before bacteria have
had a chance to be directly involved. Such rapid digestion reduces odor
and the production of smelly gases. But I do not know if the larvae
produce biostatic compounds.

Prof Viet in Vietnam has suggested that the digestive enzymes secreted
by the larvae inhibit bacterial growth and the production of odor.

Nonetheless, old larval residue of a high cellulosic content continues
to degrade within a unit through the action of fungi and actinomycetes,
and I suppose the larvae continue to digest the products of this degradation.

Initially BSF larvae do very little with certain types of waste such as
orange and lemon peel, but once this degrades and softens through the
action of bacteria and loses its acidic character, the larvae appear to
digest it without problems. Therefore that to say that they do not eat
bacteria would be wrong, but they do have a strong preference for fresh waste.

BSF larvae even devour fresh meat products, but, according to Dr. Jeff
Tomberlin, if fed only meat products, their growth is delayed.

So it is obvious that we have only scratched the surface with respect to
understanding BSF bioconversion. Your input in the upcoming BSF seminar
is an absolute must. At times we need to step outside of entomology to
understand better what is happenning to the various types of waste when
deposited into a BSF unit.

We need to understand the impact of other creatures that might work in
conjunction with BSF larvae, and your input in this respect would be
greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 15
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:26:54 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From:       "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

"Robin Ansell" <svorca@shaw.ca> asked
>As many waste streams that could be utilized for larvae feed
>are often sporadic in availability and quantity, is there
>any minimum criterion for daily "fresh" feed that must be
>observed to ensure a healthy population?

So little has been researched with respect to optimal BSF diet, BSF larvae
can be found in just about any type of putrescent waste imaginable. BSF
thrive on fresh waste, long before bacteria degrade this waste and rob it
of its nutrients. Unlike many species of fly larvae, they feed primarily
on the waste itself, and not upon the bacteria that degrade waste.

With respect to food waste, they have the ability to digest waste that is
far from being "fresh," food waste that could be 2 to 3 weeks old, covered
with fungi and mold, rancid and nasty in every respect.

As mentioned on slides 88 and 89:
"Yet at the same time, this benign creature possesses one of the most
robust digestive systems within nature. It thrives in the presence of
salts, alcohols, ammonia and a variety of food toxins."

Several studies have revealed that fly larvae in general do not favor
waste that has turned anaerobic, and I would presume that this also
applies to BSF larvae. Yet I have often deposited too much food waste per
square foot of unit surface area, and this surplus was subject to
anaerobic conditions. Eventually the BSF larvae appeared to rework this
undigested layer of anaerobic waste.

This underscores the importance of avoiding the accumulation of free
liquids in a disposal unit. If free liquids accumulate, the ability of BSF
larvae to rework waste at lower levels is severely impaired. In my
experience, keeping waste/residue relatively dry is far more important
than the age of the waste. Keeping waste dry also permits other
microorganisms that work along side BSF larvae to proliferate.

Thanks.
Paul

Paul A. Olivier, Ph.D.
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 16
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:30:12 +0100
Subject:      Wastes found in warm countries
From:       Mary Appelhof <mappelho@tds.net>

Paul,
When you say, " Special precautions against the intrusion of ants should be taken."

What kinds of precautions do you find effective, or recommend?
--
Mary Appelhof, Author of "Worms Eat My Garbage"
Subscribe to my WormEzine at:
http://www.wormwoman.com or download archives in PDF format.

>>> Posting number 17
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:38:29 +0100
Subject:      Wastes found in warm countries
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Paul Olivier wrote:
>The tropical climate of a country such as Uganda
>should enable wild adults to furnish eggs without
>any interruption.

I know that there is work done on BSF larva cultivation in Vietnam and
Cambodia. These works were presented 2 years ago in an IBSnet Internet
seminar-workshop. After the workshop, Anthony Simm tested the same
successfully in the Philippines.

Paul:
Do you know of any other work in warm countries other than those mentioned
above and in the USA.

regards
jacky foo
 

>>> Posting number 18
Date:         Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:56:11 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Slide 28 in http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm shows a "BSF
bioconversion unit" with a 2-Foot base.

Paul:
Has there been any studies conducted with these units ?

Where/how can I buy them ?

regards
jacky foo

>>> Posting number 19
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:15:11 +0100
Subject:      Countries with BSF larvae cultivation work
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo wrote
>I know that there is work done on BSF larva cultivation in Vietnam and
>Cambodia. These works were presented 2 years ago in an IBSnet Internet
>seminar-workshop. After the workshop, Anthony Simm tested the same
>successfully in the Philippines.
>
>Paul:
>Do you know of any other work in warm countries other than those mentioned
>above and in the USA.
 

The list is rather small: Vietnam, Cambodia, the Philippines and the United
States. No doubt Australia should be added to this list.

Thanks.
Paul
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 20
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:15:11 +0100
Subject:      problem of ants
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Mary Appelhof asked
>When you say, " Special precautions against the intrusion of ants should
>be taken." What kinds of precautions do you find effective, or recommend?

I know of two methods to prevent ants from entering a unit:

1) to situate the unit on a small platform with legs, with each leg
in a small container of water. This is the what Dr. Tran Tan Viet
has down with four ESR bioconversion units located in Vietnam.

2) to apply ant repellant all around the base of the unit. This is
what I have been doing here in Louisiana.

Thanks.
Paul
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 21
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:38:59 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>
>Slide 28 in http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm shows a "BSF
>bioconversion unit" with a 2-Foot base.
>Paul:
>Has there been any studies conducted with these units ?
>Where/how can I buy them ?

Well over a year ago, Dr. Tran Tan Viet fabricated a round unit in sheet
metal. Within minutes of putting prepupae in this unit, they crawled out
without any problem.

Four month ago, we fabricated 10 round units in fiberglass, and four
were put in operation in Vietnam receiving the waste from a university
kitchen. These four units function quite well. Prepupae have no problem
finding a ramp, and once they find it, they have no problem climbing up
the ramp to the very top where they fall through a pipe and into a bucket.

We have located a rotational molding company in Vietnam that will soon
begin fabrication of the mold. It will take approximately two months to
complete the mold. Production will begin as soon as the mold is finished.

The distribution and sale of the units in Vietnam and the United States
is fairly well worked out. Nothing has been finalized in other countries.

Thanks.
Paul

Paul A. Olivier, Ph.D.
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
519 West Dejean Street
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540

>>> Posting number 22
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:44:31 +0100
Subject:      Miniature pig sanctuary - BSF disposal unit evaluation
From: "Theo van Kempen" <t_vankempen@ncsu.edu>

Hi Paul,

Last week I was invited to visit a miniature pig sanctuary. This place
rescues miniature pigs deserted by people that originally adopted them
as pets. Unfortunately, one of their neighbors has started a complaint
against them for odor. Thus, the purpose of my visit was to see how bad
the problem was, and what could be done to resolve this.

This site was generally well managed, and I was very impressed with this
operation. Odor was not a major issue as far as I can tell, but I am
probably not the best judge.

One thing I noticed is that they were composting feces and bedding, and
your soldier fly project came to mind. The soldier fly setup could be a
neat way to deal with feces collected at this site. Thus, a question:
would you be willing to provide a unit for this site for evaluation? It
may provide for some good information and possibly even some PR for the
unit (ABC news was on site while I was there)....

Theo van Kempen

>>> Posting number 23
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:51:27 +0100
Subject:      BSF in camping sites
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Mary,   I would be glad to send you enough bsf eggs to populate your
camp privy.  These could work in a prefab unit that Paul is promoting or
in a reasonably well drained dug privy ( old timey outhouse).  The black
soldier fly used to go by the name of privy fly when there were lots of
outdoor toilets in the southern USA and limited house fly production there. 
I think eggs would ship better than larvae since the oxygen demand 
would be less. They would surely be lighter and cheaper if cost is a 
consideration, and isn't it always?  However, you would need to pre-rear 
the larvae for a few days so that they will have some size and be able 
to consume a significant amount of feces. This would be important for 
the first inoculation, then you could add very young larvae to maintain a 
mixed age, steady state situation.

Another thing; what will the temperatures be?

Bioconversion will be very slow below about 80F.  Once you get an active
mass of larvae they will produce some heat of their own.  If low
temperatures are a problem you could put the above ground bioconversion
chamber in a sunny spot to collect solar energy or make some other
accomodation to increase temp.  If the temp is warm enough I'm sure this will work.

I have seen very dense bsf larvae in a commercial privy in South Carolina 
and I know that Tran Tan Viet has been successful with this in Viet Nam.

Cheers,
Craig Sheppard
Univ.of GA, Semi-retired, but still kickin' around
+++
Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
PO Box 748, Tifton GA, 31793, USA
Ph (229) 386-3374
Fx (229)386-3086

>>> Posting number 24
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 08:55:52 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>
 

"R. Ansell" asked
> As many waste streams that could be utilised for larvae feed are often
> sporadic in availability and quantity, is there any minimum criterion
> for daily "fresh" feed that must be observed to ensure a healthy
> population?

Dear Mr. Ansell

I don't think anyone has actually researched your specific question, but
larger larvae can fast for months and then resume feeding and growth. So
they can obviously maintain themselves even better on a minimal diet.
Having said all of that one would need a fairly steady waste stream to
keep cycling out adults to have large numbers of younger larvae to
handle large batches of waste when they become available.  This is why
the largest populations develop in situations with a steady flow of
"waste". When depending on wild oviposition it usually takes 2-3
generations to achieve a local  population dense enough to handle a
significant stream of material.

One solution to the problem of a sporadic waste flow would be to
maintain a large number of young larvae to be introduced onto your large
waste batch.  If the period w/o large quatities is only a few weeks ,
then this should be easy to manage.

Regards,
Craig Sheppard
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
PO Box 748, Tifton GA

>>> Posting number 25
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:01:49 +0100
Subject:      Availability of BSF eggs
From: CAVM@aol.com

In order to promote the use of BSF as a waste processor we must have a
reliable supply of eggs year round.

I have visited Craig Sheppard and discussed with him a system for
providing a supply.  We agreed that the best solution was to have each
substantial user breed his own supply of flies.

This may require a cottage industries of breeders similar to the bee
keeper system.  Some persons may operate a route of breeder greenhouses,
harvest the larvae and inoculate with fresh eggs for the waste producer.
I am sure that most farmers and other producers have enough to do
already and would welcome a service provider.

It would be helpful to know who in our group is already a breeder or
intends to become a breeder supplying eggs.  The BSF industry is growing
around us.  We should plan to steer it in the direction most likely to
be successful for all concerned.

Neal Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc.
www.kentuckyenrichment.com

>>> Posting number 26
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 09:08:00 +0100
Subject:      Miniature pig sanctuary - BSF disposal unit evaluation
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

"Theo van Kempen" wrote:
>Last week I was invited to visit a miniature pig sanctuary. This place
>rescues miniature pigs deserted by people that originally adopted
>them as pets. Unfortunately, one of their neighbors has started
>a complaint against them for odor.  One thing I noticed is that 
>they were composting feces and bedding, and your soldier fly 
>project came to mind.

I have done several trials putting pig feces into my BSF larval unit
here in Louisiana. One trial was done together in Louisiana together
with Tom Matthews of Iowa State University. BSF do a rapid and efficient
job of digesting pig feces. Pictures were taken after one hour, 12 hours
and 24 hours.

I would be happy to provide, at my cost, a unit for evaluation. I could
supply one in fiberglass right now, but this unit was not fabricated
according to the drawings. The vent holes on the big and small lids are
missing. If the unit were to be situated under a roof, then the unit
could be operated without lids and the missing vent holes are
of no importance.

Thanks.
Paul
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Tel 1-337-826-5540

>>> Posting number 27
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 11:58:04 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From: Paul Totterdell <S_O_Solutions@netspeed.com.au>

I was a participant in the first conference on BSF Larvae. I have
followed the disscussion on the nature of inputs with interest.

Commercial domestic worm farms in Australia come with specific
instructions about various inputs that are not able to be recycled i.e
citrus rind. It occurs to me that a domestic recycling bin that comes
with the instruction 'any organic imput is ok' will be accepted and
taken up very quickly by the community where ever that community may be.

This is a major selling point of Pauls approach and needs to be put
forward in any recyling debate. The conveniance of being able to deposit all of your
organic waste in one recepticale and have that waste recycled is
undeniable. If the interpretation of information coming from BSF
research is correct then we now have a recycling system that will be
effective without having to rely on a major shift in societies value
systems... or in other words its easy- requires less effort than the
preceding approach, it works and its sustainable. In short this BSF bin
could recycle nutrients and protect environments by its very nature
without the need for cultural change.... its not a silver bullet but is
certainly a strategy worthy of support.

I would very much like for a social scientist that may be listening to
take up this topic and tell us this thinking is incorrect.

For these reasons I believe that Paul Oliviers system of BSF larvae
supplemented by incidental decomposition by by worms, bacteria, and a
myriad of other undescribed microbes represents a very powerful
recycling system.

Paul Totterdell
S_O_Solutions@netspeed.com.au

>>> Posting number 28
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:23:24 +0100
Subject:      Miniature pig sanctuary - BSF disposal unit evaluation
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Dear Theo,
How are these miniature pigs currently housed?  how
many are there?  Is there any chance of conducting some research-
- a follow up on the system we had going briefly at NCSU or a variation?

Thanks,
Craig

Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.

>>> Posting number 29
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:34:48 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Paul Totterdell wrote:
>This is a major selling point of Paul's approach and needs to be
>put forward in any recycling debate. The convenience of
>being able to deposit all of your organic waste in one
>receptacle and have that waste recycled is undeniable.
>If the interpretation of information coming from BSF
>research is correct then we now have a recycling system
>that will be effective without having to rely on a major
>shift in societies value systems... or in other words its
>easy- requires less effort than the preceding approach,
>it works and its sustainable. In short this BSF bin
>could recycle nutrients and protect environments by
>its very nature without the need for cultural change....
>its not a silver bullet but is certainly a strategy worthy of support.
>I would very much like for a social scientist that may
>be listening to take up this topic and tell us this
>thinking is incorrect.

But we still faced with the cultural aversion to maggots. We may call
them by any name we wish, but in the general public's perception they
will always be maggots. Even the Louisiana fisherman in the Sportsman's
Paradise is reluctant to touch them, even though they constitute a
wonderful bream and crappie bait. The funnel on the lid of the 
small unit is designed to restrict one's view into the unit,
but this may not be enough to erase the fears of the average housewife
confronted with the task of depositing food into the unit. For some
people maggot and spider belong in the same category of phobia.

A few years ago while living in Texas, a young man is his early twenties
came to visit, and I was eager to show him my new BSF disposal unit.
When I opened the lid to show him the tens of thousands of actively
feeding BSF larvae, he ran from the site struggling not to vomit. When I
view these larvae, I am filled with wonder and amazement at the power of
nature, and it is hard for me to understand the squeamishness that might
exist within the general public. Here, no doubt, is the greatest obstacle 
to the proliferation of BSF technology.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 30
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:34:48 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Paul Totterdell wrote:
>Commercial domestic worm farms in Australia come with specific
>instructions about various inputs that are not able to be recycled i.e
>citrus rind. It occurs to me that a domestic recycling bin that comes
>with the instruction 'any organic input is ok' will be accepted and
>taken up very quickly by the community where ever that community may be.

I can confirm from my own recent experience the ability of BSF larvae to
digest fresh orange rind. During our last trip to Vietnam, my wife and I
had become spoiled in drinking fresh orange juice for breakfast. Upon
returning to the States, she decided to buy oranges to make fresh 
orange juice each morning, rather than buy the usual orange juice out of 
a plastic container. Each morning she squeezes about four oranges, 
 and our BSF unit began to receive an unusually high amount of orange 
rind. I was delighted to see that the BSF larvae  process this orange 
rind without problems.

>...I believe that Paul Olivier's system of BSF larvae
>supplemented by incidental decomposition by worms, bacteria, and a
>myriad of other undescribed microbes represents a very powerful
>recycling system.

Nothing in nature can rival the power of BSF larvae to dispose of
putrescent waste, but it will not be an easy task for these larvae to
gain social and cultural acceptance.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 31
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:38:34 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From: Uwe Brunjes <ubrunjes@yahoo.com>

Paul Totterdell wrote:
> Commercial domestic worm farms in Australia come with specific
> instructions about various inputs that are not able
> to be recycled i.e  citrus rind. It occurs to me that a domestic
> recycling bin that comes with the instruction 'any organic imput is ok' will
> be accepted and taken up very quickly by the community where ever
> that community may be.

Hi Paul,

nice to see you again! - Maybe there is another way to use the citrus rinds.

There is a growing industry and market for citrus oil, extracted from
the rind. If volume of production warrants it, you could first extract
the oil, making a profit and offering a more "palatable" selection of
"wastes" to the larvae.

Best regards,

Uwe

>>> Posting number 32
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 16:38:34 +0100
Subject:      BSF in camping sites
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

BSF eggs appear to be quite fragile, whereas newly hatched, pre-reared
larvae should be a lot more robust and easier to ship.

Craig,
to prevent oxygen deprivation, would it not make sense to ship
pre-reared larvae in a small amount of dry sawdust?

Have you ever tried this?

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC

>>> Posting number 33
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:01:42 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

 "Paul Olivier"
>But we still faced with the cultural aversion to maggots.
>....no doubt, is the greatest obstacle to the proliferation
>of BSF technology.

At a household level I would agree with you on the aversion to maggots.
However, I am a strong believer that if money can be made or saved,
there will be some people who will do it.

At the community level, less volume in wastes to be collected for
disposal also means that less trips are need to the landfill. This means
savings in transport fuel costs and less staff needed. My observation in
East Africa, e.g. Kampala, is that skits (large rubbish containers - see
http://www.ias.unu.edu/proceedings/icibs/ibs/info/uganda/PB290007-skit.j
pg ) are often collected once a week. Much of the wastes is organic in
nature. Skits at market places usually contain putrescent wastes. The
picture shows a skit at a boarding school in Kampala and it also
contains kitchen wastes and lawn grass.

How can we develop a project at this site ?

Does it make sense to install 10 of Paul's 2-foot base units and
generate larvae to feed 10 hens, and also to use lawn grass of beddings
for the hen house?

Will a reward of half the eggs collected encourage some girl students to
feed the BSF larvae ?

I think it is possible !

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 34
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:19:14 +0100
Subject:      Availability of BSF eggs
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Dear Neal,

As you know, we have discussed on a few occasions how to structure a
commercial bsf egg supply for bioconversion.  Could they be economically
shipped from a central location or would each bioconversion site need to
independently produce ggs/young larvae?

We decided, and I still think this is correct, that large bioconversion
sites (CAFO's and municipal sites, perhaps) will have to cycle adults
from prepupae and have the complete life cycle on-site to be
economically viable.

Still, there will be a need for starter populations for these large
sites and for smaller bioconverters, whether they want a starter or to
order eggs repeatedly.

I have thought that I might provide eggs commercially " in the future".
Well, the future may be here soon.  If there will be some sort of steady
demand I could possibly set up facilities to supply the continental US.
I've talked to Paul Olivier and his anticipated domestic unit sales may
create a significant demand for bsf eggs.

Mary Applehof, do you see a significant demand?

Neal VanMilligan and I have been discussing this lately and we think
there will be demand from food animal producers.

Can anyone else provide information on this question of demand for bsf eggs?

Thanks in advance for the feedback--
Craig Sheppard
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
Tifton GA,
Ph (229) 386-3374

>>> Posting number 35
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 18:22:12 +0100
Subject:      BSF in camping sites
From: Craig Sheppard [mailto:sheppard@tifton.uga.edu]

Paul Olivier asked
> BSF eggs appear to be quite fragile, whereas newly hatched,
>pre-reared larvae should be a lot more robust and easier to ship.
>
> Craig,
> to prevent oxygen deprivation, would it not make sense to ship
> pre-reared larvae in a small amount of dry sawdust?
>
> Have you ever tried this?

Paul, In our system female bsf lay egg masses into the small spaces in
cardboard, so they are prepackaged and mail very well. We have had very
good results mailing viable eggs this way.

Regards,
Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology

>>> Posting number 36
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:47:34 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: Charles Twesigye <cktwesigye@mulib.mak.ac.ug>

Jacky

Have you thought about the security of the "10 of Paul's 2-foot base
units installed in Kampala?"

In schools and Universities, the BSF Technology may have higher chances
of success. I do agree with you that if there are demonstrated economic
benefits, the cultural issues may be overcome with time!!

Charles Twesigye
Kyambogo University

>>> Posting number 37
Date:         Wed, 3 Mar 2004 19:58:32 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Gary Breitenbeck" <gbreitenbeck@agctr.lsu.edu>

Paul:
I agree that the maggot issue, especially when joined with anything food
related, is a probably deal breaker.

A few years ago we developed some composting units for processing fish
cleaning wastes and installed prototypes at recreational fish cleaning
stations alone the coast.
Curiously, BSF larvae enthusiastically volunteered in these units. While
the process was highly effective and eliminated odor problems, the
vibrating mass of large larvae, not to mention the continuous stream of
escapees, was simply more than the general public could bear. We removed
the units.

Later I discussed this experience with a group at Cornell that have
dealt with similar waste problems.

In New York, some marina owners use BSF larvae to process fish-cleaning
wastes, collecting the larvae and dying them vibrant colors.  These
'cheeto' colored grubs have apparently found far greater acceptance as
fish bait than their natural cadaver-colored cousins.

--Gary Breitenbeck, LSU

>>> Posting number 38
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:37:51 +0100
Subject:      Availability of BSF eggs
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Craig Sheppard wrote:
>I have thought that I might provide eggs commercially " in the future".
>Well, the future may be here soon.  If there will be some sort of steady
>demand I could possibly set up facilities to supply the continental US.
>I've talked to Paul Olivier and his anticipated domestic unit sales may
>create a significant demand for bsf eggs.

Craig,
I am truly excited about the fact that you may provide BSF eggs
commercially. As I mentioned to you today on the phone, the town of
Eugene, Oregon, of a population of 120,000 people, has as many as 30,000
vermi-composting bins in operation. Once people understand the
advantages of BSF-composting, I do anticipate a strong demand for my
bioconversion units, especially in California, Oregon and Washington. I
think that there will always be a need for an egg starter kit to
jump-start the process, especially in commercial operations that depend
on a steady population of larvae to digest large quantities of
putrescent  waste.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier.
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 39
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:37:51 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Gary Breitenbeck wrote:
>A few years ago we developed some composting units for
>processing fish cleaning wastes and installed prototypes
>at recreational fish cleaning stations alone the coast.
>Curiously, BSF larvae enthusiastically volunteered in these
>units. While the process was highly effective and eliminated
>odor problems, the vibrating mass of large larvae, not to
>mention the continuous stream of escapees, was simply
>more than the general public could bear. We removed the units.

Please explain. Did the general public stop putting fish waste in these
units? If so, what did they do with the fish waste?

>Later I discussed this experience with a group at Cornell
>that have dealt with similar waste problems.

Was the Cornell group also dealing with BSF larvae?

>In New York, some marina owners use BSF larvae to process
>fish-cleaning wastes, collecting the larvae and dying them
>vibrant colors.  These 'cheeto' colored grubs have apparently
>found far greater acceptance as fish bait than their natural
>cadaver-colored cousins.

I am excited about the use of BSF larvae to process fish waste in New
York. This is the first I hear of the active and sustained presence of
BSF in that state. And I am even more excited about the dyeing of larvae
to make them more presentable to humans as fish bait. I have been
struggling to start a BSF bait industry in Louisiana, and no doubt there
is a lot to learn from this New York experience.

How to contact these marina owners?
What kind of dyes are they using?

Thanks.

Paul OLivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 40
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 06:45:47 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: "R. Ansell" <svorca@shaw.ca>

Paul Totterdell wrote:
>...I believe that Paul Olivier's system of BSF larvae
>supplemented by incidental decomposition by worms, bacteria, and a
>myriad of other undescribed microbes represents a very powerful
>recycling system.

Paul Olivier replied:
>Nothing in nature can rival the power of BSF larvae
>to dispose of putrescent waste, but it will not be an easy
>task for these larvae to gain social and cultural acceptance.

This is bang on.

However there is a cloud on the horizon that has come more to the fore
recently with the discovery of the 2 cases of BSE and that is
traceability and purity of feed for livestock.

We are continually asked by our customers what we feed our animals and
consequently for any bought in feed we demand not only a breakdown of
the nutrient components but also their source so that we can, for
example,  be sure that our cattle feed does not contain any animal based
protein etc.

We expect more and more regulation of farming activities, as appearing
to act decisively on a perceived possible public health issue is a sure
fire winner for vote hungry politicians.

It will be critical, therefore, that any animal feed produced from BSF
larvae has traceability and that the larvae do not concentrate toxins or
other undesireables that may be present in only trace quantities in the
waste to be consumed.

Has any work been carried out on toxin concentrations in BSF larvae? I
imagine this would be more likely to show up in the longer lived
overwintering ones.

(Remember the recent scare over apparently 'high' level of pcb's in
farmed salmon as a result of concentration through the feed processing -
the science wasn't particularly rigorous but it was picked up by the
media and is now out in the public domain)

Best regards
Robin

>>> Posting number 41
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 07:15:56 +0100
Subject:      Vietnam - activities
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Information on BSF pre-pupae production activities in Vietnam from Paul Olivier are:

>Prof. Tran Tan Viet in Vietnam has had great success in raising
>redworms on BSF residue, but I suppose that this was done
>in separate bins. Both creatures have different life cycle requirements,
>and it may prove easier to grow them in separate bins.

>I know of two methods to prevent ants from entering a unit:
>1) to situate the unit on a small platform with legs, with each leg
>in a small container of water. This is the what Dr. Tran Tan Viet
>has down with four ESR bioconversion units located in Vietnam.

>Four month ago, we fabricated 10 round units in fiberglass, and four
>were put in operation in Vietnam receiving the waste from a university
>kitchen.

I located info on a research grant application (SAREC Regional fund)
(2001-2003) - Project title : "Developing integrated systems for
converting agricultural  and household waste to animal protein with the
Black Soldier Fly (Hermetia illucens L.)"
http://www.mekarn.org/Research/cam4.htm

Q1: if 4 fiberglass units are used for wastes from a university kitchen,
how are the remaining 6 (of the 10 fabricated) used ?

Q2: has there been any work done at the household level ?

Q3: were there any earlier studies before 2001 or any other studies done?

Q4: will fiberglass units be tested at UTA ecological farm in Chamcar
Daung, Phnom Penh, Cambodia ?

Regards
Jacky
http://segate.sunet.se/archives/et-w3.html

>>> Posting number 42
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:00:49 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo wrote:
>At the community level, less volume in wastes to be collected for
>disposal also means that less trips are need to the landfill. This
means
>savings in transport fuel costs and less staff needed.

I agree....... As nasty as maggots seem to be, they are the best that
nature provides to dispose of putrescent waste.

Your argument from the economics of waste management make perfect sense,
no matter where in the world we may be.

On average, in the United States, it costs $80 per ton to transport food
waste to a landfill and another $31 per ton to dump it in a landfill.
BSF technology eliminates both the transport and landfilling of food
waste.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC

>>> Posting number 43
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 12:02:59 +0100
Subject:      Feed Input Rate
From: "R. Ansell" <svorca@shaw.ca>

"Craig Shepard" wrote:
>One solution to the problem of a sporadic waste flow would be
>to maintain a large number of young larvae to be introduced
>onto your large waste batch.  If the period w/o large quantities
>is only a few weeks , then this should be easy to manage.

Craig

Thanks for the encouraging info. It is not uncommon for us to receive a
pickup truck load of bakery returns one day and then nothing for 2 or 3
weeks so with a bit of patience with respect to growth rate of the
larvae it should work out OK. It should certainly be more energy
efficient that freezing the excess as we do at the present.

Best regards
Robin

>>> Posting number 44
Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 15:58:24 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

R. Ansell"  wrote
>It will be critical, therefore, that any animal feed produced
>from BSF larvae has traceability and that the larvae do not
>concentrate toxins or other undesireables that may be
>present in only trace quantities in the waste to be consumed.

BSF larvae have the power to digest and break down nutrients that more
complicated organisms miss, as is readily seen in their ability to
extract nutrients from various types of fecal matter. One should suppose
that BSF larvae are what they eat, that they are as free of undesirables
as the waste that they eat. In the case of food waste, I would not be so
concerned about the waste itself, but about some other undesirable waste
product that was inadvertently thrown out along with it. The moment BSF
larvae are integrated back into the food chain, its suitability for this
purpose must be strictly monitored.

>Has any work been carried out on toxin concentrations in
>BSF larvae? I imagine this would be more likely to show
>up in the longer lived overwintering ones.

I am not aware of any studies carried out in area.

>(Remember the recent scare over apparently 'high' level of
>pcb's in farmed salmon as a result of concentration through
>the feed processing - the science wasn't particularly rigorous
>but it was picked up by the media and is now out in the
>public domain)

I am continually confronted with the issue of PCB's.

In the recycling of automobile and industrial waste, all components
containing PCB's must be removed by hand from the waste prior to
introducing it into the shredder. But this is a very costly procedure,
and large amounts of PCB's inevitably end up in the non-ferrous fraction
that my separators must deal with. Here in the United States, automobile
fluff generally contains high levels of  PCB's and heavy metals, and
somehow through some contorted logic, fluff is considered to have a
positive value in its use as landfill cover. How many times have my
separators been shut down due to the presence of PCB's, simply because
further up the recycling chain, someone failed to do his or her job!

I am afraid that in any recycling effort, we will always be confronted
with such complexity and interdependency, but that does not mean that we
should abandon every effort to recycle. Strict guidelines must be
established for the use of BSF larvae in the recycling of putrescent
waste.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC

>>> Posting number 45
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 16:21:14 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

R. Ansell wrote:
>.......recently with the discovery of the 2 cases of BSE and that is
>traceability and purity of feed for livestock.
>
>Remember the recent scare over apparently 'high' level
>of pcb's in farmed salmon as a result of concentration through
>the feed processing

PCBs (polychlorinated biphenyls) in farmed salmon came from the fish
meal (made mostly from ground small fish and has high levels of fish oil
to fatten the salmon. PCB's concentrate in fats).

Let's say we want to load our BSF larvae with PCBs.

How do we contaminate a BSF unit
(a) in a restaurant in Hanoi
(b) in a boarding school in Kampala
(c) beside a rubbish skit that receives everything imaginable from a
market in Nairobi.
(d) at Robin Ansell's small farm

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 46
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:05:42 +0100
Subject:      BSF prepupae as a feedstock for salmon
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky wrote:
>PCBs (polychlorinated biphenyls) in farmed salmon came
>from the fish meal (made mostly from ground small fish
>and has high levels of fish oil to fatten the salmon.
>PCB's concentrate in fats).

BSF prepupae contain a large percentage of fats (34%).

Has anyone studied their suitability as a feedstock for salmon?

Thanks.
Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC

>>> Posting number 47
Date:         Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:05:42 +0100
Subject:      Vietnam - activities
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo asked:
>Q1: if 4 fiberglass units are used for wastes from a
>university kitchen, how are the remaining 6
>(of the 10 fabricated) used ?

Dr. Tran Tan Viet has situated four units at a university restaurant and
one unit at his house. The remaining five units were shipped to me.

>Q2: has there been any work done at the household level ?

Dr. Viet had a round metal unit on trial for about a year at his house,
and he has had a fiberglass unit on trial at his house for about 3 months.

>Q3: were there any earlier studies before 2001
>or any other studies done

Not with the new round unit. Other studies were done in Vietnam with
large rectangular units.

>Q4: will fiberglass units be tested at UTA ecological farm
>in Chamcar Daung, Phnom Penh, Cambodia ?

I am not aware that they have made a request. In 2 to 3
months we will start production of the small unit by means of
rotational molding. The fiberglass unit without vent holes
should not be tested any further.

Thanks.

Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Tel 1-337-826-5540

>>> Posting number 48
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:37:29 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Gary Breitenbeck wrote:
>A few years ago we developed some composting units for
>processing fish cleaning wastes and installed prototypes
>at recreational fish cleaning stations alone the coast.
>Curiously, BSF larvae enthusiastically volunteered in these units.

There is a good chance that the larvae digesting the fish refuse were
blow flies.  This is more likely than a robust bsf population in NY.
Blow flies seem to be better at digesting animal tissue, anway.

-- Craig

Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.

>>> Posting number 49
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:37:29 +0100
Subject:      BSF prepupae as a feedstock for salmon
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Salmon producers from Washington state, I think it was expressed
interest in prepupal meal as a feed ingredient years ago.  Judging by
our promising results in catfish trials it should be tested in salmon diets.

Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
Tifton GA, 31793 USA

>>> Posting number 50
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:42:17 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: Mary Appelhof <mappelho@tds.net>

Paul said,
>When I opened the lid to show him the tens of thousands of
>actively feeding BSF larvae, he ran from the site struggling
>not to vomit. When I view these larvae, I am filled with
>wonder and amazement at the power of nature, and it is
>hard for me to understand the squeamishness that might
>exist within the general public. Here, no doubt, is the
>greatest obstacle to the proliferation of BSF technology."

Yes, overcoming people's aversion to maggots will be a challenge. But I
believe it can be done. After all, thirty years ago people tried to
discourage me from trying to get people to take a colony of redworms
into their homes to convert their kitchen wastes to nutrient-rich humus.
They'd say, "Mary, you'll never get people to do it!" And a
lot still won't. But I gave them the kind of information they needed to
do it successfully through my book, "Worms Eat My Garbage," and it has
now sold over 165,000 copies. There are probably a dozen different
vermicomposting units on the market. Worm Digest Forum has over 26,000
archived messages. Vermicomposting generates 17,500 Google hits, and
worm composting 50,800 hits.

There is a lot of interest out there.

Amy Stewart, in her newly published (and delightful book!) "The Earth
Moved: On the Remarkable Achievements of Earthworms," wrote,
    "Sometimes when I dig in (my worm bin) the worms are so
     thick that they look like ground beef set in motion, a mass
     of churning bodies. It is hard to think of them as individuals. ."

Amy then went on to describe how she selected a good sturdy specimen,
held it in her hand, and observed both her and the worm's reactions to
this intentional encounter.Amy maintained a worm bin for years and was
able to overcome her original aversion to worms to the extent she became
so fascinated with them she has written a book about them that is
getting rave reviews in the New York Times, Boston Globe, Kirkus
Reviews. . . dozens of places.
You can visit her blog at http://www.amystewart.com

Kids seeing a worm bin in the classroom for the first time start with
"Yucks!" But the before the end of the hour they're wanting to hold a
worm in their hand. It'll take time, but I think it can happen with BSF larvae.

Mary Appelhof

--
Mary Appelhof, Author of "Worms Eat My Garbage"
Flowerfield Enterprises,10332 Shaver Road,Kalamazoo, MI 49024 USA
PLEASE NOTE NEW AREA CODE:
PH:269-327-0108  FAX 269-327-7009
http://www.wormwoman.com

>>> Posting number 51
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:50:59 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: "Michael Theroux" <mtheroux@jdmt.net>

Hello all:

I am a licensed enviro health specialist in California, with a career
focused on waste management, resource recovery, and in general in
turning waste into energy and products. Much of this work has involved
finding methods of contaminant tracking and matching these to permitting
mechanisms and regulatory path development. As a strong proponent of BSF
commercialization, I'll weigh in here with a few cautions
and suggestions.

I'm very pleased with the rigor of the dialogue and attention to the
more difficult aspects encountered.

Robin Ansell wrote:
>... It will be critical, therefore, that any animal feed
>produced from BSF larvae has traceability and that the
>larvae do not concentrate toxins or other undesireables
>that may be present in only trace quantities in the
>waste to be consumed..."

Biological concentration of PCBs, trace heavy metals and so many other
environmental contaminants, requires "manifesting" our feedstock: we
MUST be able to profile in-coming materials and track them through the system.

If we can't assure the incoming contaminant profile and do not
understand and/or cannot control the concentration within the process,
we  have two choices:
(a) know absolutely where the resulting product will go, and tightly
control any and all return to the food chain, or
(b) decline acceptance of that potential feedstock.

Usually, a suspect potential feedstock supplier must themselves provide credible
third-party lab testing initially and periodically. This generally
forces folks to pay closer attention to their waste generation and to
indeed "clean up their act", if they want to participate. This has been 
applied far more consistently to special waste and hazardous waste 
handling, yet I see the need expanding every time we approach
alternative waste to product management.

This isn't to say that BSF might not be wholly appropriate for
decomposition of contaminated organic materials; we just cannot allow
the resulting product to be misused. Even as "waste", we have
drastically reduced the weight and volume of the
end-product, and that alone holds excellent value in many instances.

Lessons can be applied from parallel developments. This "cumulative"
difficulty surfaced seriously in the western US as use of "biosolids"
became wide-spread as an alternative to strict disposal. The term
"biosolids" would on the surface appear to be simply human sewage, or
"humanure" as Mary Applehof so nicely put it. Yet the materials were
actually the sludges from sewer treatment processes that accepted
industrial liquid wastes ... and anything else that could be washed down the sewer.

Standards for maximum contaminant "soil loading" were promulgated to
allow land-spreading on some agricultural lands; after a decade,
accumulated levels have been reached and the practice is running out of room.

Another potential difficulty in such accumulation has come to light
recently with grass clippings and other "green waste" destined for
composting: resistant herbicides of the class Clopyralid pass through
even the best composting processes. Those interested in pursuing this
complex topic may want to contact David Haskell, California Department
of Pesticide Regulations, and chair of the Clopyralid
assessment program [dhaskell@cdpr.ca.gov].

Michael Theroux
Theroux Environmental
11960 Heritage Oak Place, Suite One
PO Box 7838
Auburn, CA  95604-7838, USA
(530) 823-7300 ext. 203; fax: -7290

Pacific Southwest Combined Heat & Power Initiative (PSWCHPI;
www.pswchpi.org)
United States Combined Heat & Power Association (USCHPA;
www.uschpa.org)

>>> Posting number 52
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 08:53:59 +0100
Subject:      BSF prepupae as a feedstock for salmon
From: "Theo van Kempen" <t_vankempen@ncsu.edu>

"Paul Olivier" wrote:
>BSF prepupae contain a large percentage of fats (34%).

On paper, BSF have a pretty interesting nutritional composition.
However, I would be curious to see how well they are digested by
livestock and species such as Salmon. This since some insect proteins
(i.e, chitin) are very hard to break down.

Has anybody done any tests on this?

 Theo

>>> Posting number 53
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 09:49:53 +0100
Subject:      BSF in cold countries
From: CAVM@aol.com

I understand that the BSF larvae prefer to be kept around 80F in order
to maximize their effectiveness as recyclers.

In hog farms and layer egg farms the waste to be processed is likely to
be in a pit beneath the animals.  Whether in these cases or in the case
of food waste the BSF larvae may need heated conditions to thrive.

We can recommend a hot water system using Pex hot water pipe to keep the
subject material warm efficiently.  The water for the heating system can
be produced by any number of means although we suggest solar with an
insulated storage tank.  This would be supplemented by either biomass
combustion, gasification, or used motor oil fueled boilers.

This can be surprisingly inexpensive and effective.  We use similar
systems for heating poultry houses now.

Neal Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc.
www.kentuckyenrichment.com
cavm@aol.com

>>> Posting number 54
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:51:55 +0100
Subject:      BSF in cold countries
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Neal Van Milligen wrote:
>In hog farms and layer egg farms the waste to be
>processed is likely to be in a pit beneath the animals.
>Whether in these cases or in the case of food waste
>the BSF larvae may need heated conditions to thrive.
>We can recommend a hot water system using Pex hot
>water pipe to keep the subject material warm efficiently.
>The water for the heating system can be produced
>by any number of means although we suggest solar with an
>insulated storage tank.  This would be supplemented by
>either biomass combustion, gasification, or used
>motor oil fueled boilers.

If the waste is processed in the same building as the chickens or
animals,  and if these chickens or animals are kept sufficiently warm to
assure their health and growth, then BSF larvae will add to this their
own heat, and will easily maintain temperatures within the bed of waste
in the upper 90's F. In providing heat to the chickens or animals, we
also are providing a background heat for the larvae, and to this is
added the heat produced by the larvae themselves.

Therefore, I do not think that it would be necessary to heat the waste
in the direct manner you describe. Heat the animals or chickens being
raised, and the BSF larvae should take care of the rest.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC
www.esrla.com

>>> Posting number 55
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 15:51:55 +0100
Subject:      the maggot factor
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Mary Appelhof wrote:
>Kids seeing a worm bin in the classroom for the first time
>start with "Yucks!" But the before the end of the hour
>they're wanting to hold a worm in their hand.
>It'll take time, but I think it can happen with BSF larvae.

Mary,
Your entire reflection on the maggot factor is right on, especially with
regard to the eduction of children. The University of North Texas in
Denton has a program headed by Ken Dickson in which tens of thousand of
primary school children are invited each year to attend workshops on
recycling, and this program includes introducing these young children to
the marvel of vermi-composting. No doubt the same can be done for BSF.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier

>>> Posting number 56
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:10:33 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>
 

Paul Olivier
>We have located a rotational molding company in Vietnam
>that will soon begin fabrication of the mold. It will take
>approximately two months to complete the mold.
>Production will begin as soon as the mold is finished.

Suppose you distribute 50 2-foot base bioconversion units to 50
households in a defined area in Vietnam, the product from this
participation of households will be prepupae larvae.

Q: how much (weight) can a unit generate (per day)?
Q: how can a household use of the prepupae that they produce onsite ?
Q: how often does the household need to empty the larvae collection
bucket ?
Q: how can a business plan be developed for this group of 50 households
with a cash gain ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 57
Date:         Fri, 5 Mar 2004 16:15:29 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From:       Scott Costa <scosta@zoo.uvm.edu>

Robin Ansell wrote:
>However there is a cloud on the horizon that has come
>more to the fore recently with the discovery of the
>2 cases of BSE and that is traceability and purity of feed
>for livestock.

I have had a similar concern. Given the robustness of BSE to breakdown
by physical and chemical agents I think there may be reason for some
concern, especially if the BSF are rendered and put into that food stream.

I believe that in the previous e-seminar contamination by bacteria from
fecal matter was discussed. Maybe this could be addressed again.

Dr. Scott D. Costa
Research Assistant Professor
University of Vermont
Entomology Research Laboratory
Dept. of Plant and Soil Science
661 Spear St., Burlington VT 05405-0105, USA
(802)656-5441
FAX (802)658-7710

>>> Posting number 58
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:39:49 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo asked
>Q: how can a business plan be developed for this
>group of 50 households with a cash gain ?

We have been debating this point for several months. One young
businessman in Saigon would like to supply BSF units to households, and
buy and resell  the larvae. He prefers the turnkey approach that Breitenbeck 
advocates rather than the retailing of BSF units.

If a small unit in Vietnam could produce, on average, one kg of prepupae per day,
and if a household could receive 2,000 VN dong per kg of prepupae (approximately
$0.13 US dollars), which represents half the value of a kg of rice, then the cost of
a unit (hopefully less than $40 in Vietnam) would be covered in less than a year.
The price of $0.13 per kg may not sound like a lot of money to most people in the West,
 but the wage of an average worker in Vietnam is only one US dollar per day.

If the economics of the marketing and sale of coconut husk could be applied to
BSF prepupae, then this would drastically change the above reasoning.
Coconut husk in Vietnam is so abundant that it is considered to be a
waste product. Yet when packaged and shipped to Germany in plastic
wrapping, it sells for more than $1.00 US dollar per kg. If live-food
for reptiles and tropical fish sells in the United States for more $4.00
per pound, perhaps there are speciality markets that the production of
BSF prepupae could address. But at a local level, live BSF larvae in
Vietnam are at best poultry or fish food, and their price is set by the
value of the poultry or fish they sustain.

Perhaps, I have rambled too far in the above reasoning, but we must find
a way to turn the bioconversion of food waste into a direct means of making money
in countries such as Vietnam. There is a financial analysis of local
markets that must take place, and at this stage in the evolution of BSF
technology in tropical countries, grants targeted toward the economic
aspects of BSF technology should be given the highest priority.
 Dr. Tran Tan Viet, as both entomologist and botanist, has his eyes wide open 
for economic opportunities, and his exciting work with BSF residue and
orchids is just one example of the type of creativity that most be
brought to the table.

Dr. Tran Tan Viet has discovered that this mix of larval residue and
coconut husk constitutes an excellent growing medium for a particular
type of very expensive orchid. This medium inhibits the growth of a
particular fungus that attacks this orchid.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC
www.esrla.com

>>> Posting number 59
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 07:39:49 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo asked
>Suppose you distribute 50 2-foot base bioconversion units to 50
>households in a defined area in Vietnam, the product from this
>participation of households will be prepupae larvae.
>
>Q: how much (weight) can a unit generate (per day)?

Under optimal conditions, a small unit can receive, on average, 12.9 lbs
or 5.85 kgs of food waste per day, producing on average 2.58 lbs or 1.17
kgs of prepupae per day.

>Q: how can a household make use of the prepupae
>that they produce onsite ?

On a local level in Vietnam, live prepupae could be fed to poultry or fish.

>Q: how often does the household need to empty the
>larvae collection bucket ?

I suggest the use of a fairly large larvae collection bucket, much
larger than what is depicted in my presentation. This bucket should be
large enough to contain up to three gallons (over 11 liters) of prepupae
and sawdust (or any other dry and absorbent biomass).

The sawdust absorbs any moisture or liquids associated with the
prepupae, and it prevents them from congregating in tight formation at
the bottom of the bucket. At times, the prepupae will constrict
themselves so tightly at the bottom of a bucket that they cut off oxygen
and die. The sawdust allows the prepupae to spread out evenly throughout
the bucket, and it creates much-needed air spaces between them.

This allows the prepupae to be left within the collection bucket for at
least a 7 to 10 days. In the usual Aspen sawdust that I use to store
prepupae, at times pupation and emergence are delayed for up to six
months. Since October, I have been keeping a large box of prepupae in
sawdust. They appear to be quite lively and vigorous, yet no emergence
has taken place.

Is emergence completely temperature driven? or is it linked to the
quality of the medium in which the prepupae are stored? or both?

You might also ask,
Q: how often does the household need to empty the disposal unit itself?

If 5.85 kgs of food waste are deposited into the unit each day, and if
this food waste reduces in weight and volume by 95%,´then the small unit
would have to be emptied every 2.28 years. But Vietnamese food contains
a large quantity of free liquids,
and if the food waste and residue are to be prevented from turning anaerobic,
they must be mixed with a fair amount of coconut husk to absorb these
liquids. Coconut husk contains a high percentage of cellulose that the
larvae cannot directly digest. So the reduction in weight and volume
would be a lot less than 95%. Until studies are done to determine the
amount of coconut husk that would have to be added on average to
Vietnamese foods, it will be difficult to say how often the units would
have to be emptied. My guess would be about once every 8 to 12 months.

Dr. Tran Tan Viet has discovered that this mix of larval residue and
coconut husk constitutes an excellent growing medium for a particular
type of very expensive orchid. This medium inhibits the growth of a
particular fungus that attacks this orchid.
 

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC
www.esrla.com

>>> Posting number 60
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:32:32 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Paul Olivier wrote:
>On a local level in Vietnam, live prepupae could be fed to
>poultry or fish.

To Paul, Tran and others who are familiar with raising chickens at home

If I have chickens in my yard (fenced or free-ranched), my routine would
be to call for the chickens and throw them any kitchen wastes and food
leftovers that my house generates.

If you encourage me to buy your conversion unit, I must be convinced
that the unbit can convert wastes into prepupae that serves as a much
much better feed for my chickens. 40 USD in Vietnam has a value of 40
days pay for a poor person. Who in the USA would pay a 1000 USD
equivalent for a unit to convert your kitchen wastes into prepupae for
your chickens ?

Looking for a second approach !
The international price of oil or petrol for vehicles is pretty standard
and increases due to local taxes. So a Swedish pays almost the same
price as a Ugandan whose  monthly salaries is several times less. The
same comparison is true for a USA citizen and a Swede. This means that
any savings in reducing transportation costs for moving wastes to a
landfill would be greatly appreciated by the town council.

How can we design a project to generate data to show that we can reduce
the number of trips to the landfill ? We know that it will reduce the
volume of wastes but does this means also the reduction of trips ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 61
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 08:37:07 +0100
Subject:      BSF in camping sites
From: "Mike Barnett" <dreadlox@cwjamaica.com>

Greetings to all fellow BSF-ers!!

Paul Olivier wrote:
> BSF eggs appear to be quite fragile, whereas newly hatched, pre-reared
> larvae should be a lot more robust and easier to ship.
>
> Craig,
> to prevent oxygen deprivation, would it not make sense to ship
> pre-reared larvae in a small amount of dry sawdust?
> Have you ever tried this?

Paul,

I can vouch for the viability of eggs sent over 24 hrs from the
continent to here in the tropics.

Within 2 days I had hatch-out of of hundreds of thousand of eggs without any
problem. Problems will arise where the mail/shipment is not reliable.
Btw, eggs were sent "direct layed" in cardboard like Craig suggests, in
a small ziplock bag.

No problems experienced at all!!

Mike Barnett
JAMAICA

>>> Posting number 62
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 12:35:24 +0100
Subject:      BSF in warm countries
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Slide 81 in http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm:
>During the warmer summer months,
>overcrowding easily occurs, and this
>overcrowding gives rise to high temperatures
>within the disposal unit.

If the air temperature 40 Celcius and a 2-foot bioconversion unit is not
under direct sun, what are the risks in getting an overheated unit with
dead larvae ?

I understand that the collection bucket will prevent larvae from
escaping which reduces the risk of larvae crawling all over the kitchen floor.

Slide 83:
>Paradoxically it would appear that BSF disposal
>units function far better in winter than in summer.

How would you change the design for warm countries ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 63
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:03:50 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: Uwe Brunjes <ubrunjes@yahoo.com>

Jacky Foo wrote:
> If you encourage me to buy your conversion unit, I
> must be convinced that the bin can convert wastes
>into prepupae that serves as a much
> much better feed for my chickens. 40 USD in Vietnam
> has a value of 40 days pay for a poor person. Who in
>the USA would pay a 1000 USD
> equivalent for a unit to convert your kitchen wastes
> into prepupae for your chickens ?

thanks for raising a very important point here! The average "John Doe"
is just not a business man; he most likely won't be able to invest money
in a new, unknown enterprise, nor does he have the interest and/or
knowledge. For a very good reason he is an employee (or underemployed)
and will remain in that position. In any case he might want to raise BSF
as a hobby, for reasons of conscience (ecology), or as an ideal feed for
his fancy pets.

On the other hand, I could imagine that more than one enterpreneur would
go for it, given what we already know about raising BSF for profit. Of
course there are still issues a good scientist wants to clarify, but the
business man understands that there is no business without any risk, and
he also knows that being at the forefront is a big advantage. So he is
more likely to take a risk and do this business.

Though I can clearly see and appreciate the philantropical intentions,
trying to get the general population interested in BSF might not be the
best way to go, from the point of view of net results. For a comparison,
just look at how many percent of all
residential organic wastes is converted by worms, another good and
well-established practice. But a reasonably big business that transforms
a high percentage of all the organic wastes of a city or big feedlot,
now that sounds like a feasible idea to me.

Just a thought!

Uwe

>>> Posting number 64
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:03:50 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo wrote:
>To Paul, Tran and others who are familiar with raising chickens at home
>
>If I have chickens in my yard (fenced or free-ranched), my routine would
>be to call for the chickens and throw them any kitchen wastes and food
>leftovers that my house generates.

If you have food waste that can be directly consumed by chickens, such
as old rice, then it does not make sense to feed it to BSF larvae. The
inefficiency attached to movement between trophic levels is too great.
Likewise, I only feed to my larvae what my dogs cannot eat. If food
waste in Vietnam could be fed efficiently to pigs and chickens, then I
suppose that no food waste would be reporting to landfills. While in
Saigon, I have see people collect food waste from households and feed
this waste to pigs. All that we say now about chickens in Vietnam is
provisional, since, due to bird flu, there are no chickens in Vietnam.

>Looking for a second approach !
>The international price of oil or petrol for vehicles is pretty standard
>and increases due to local taxes. So a Swedish pays almost the same
>price as a Ugandan whose  monthly salaries is several times less. The
>same comparison is true for a USA citizen and a Swede. This means that
>any savings in reducing transportation costs for moving wastes to a
>landfill would be greatly appreciated by the town council.

Obviously, this second approach makes the most sense.

We have tried to climb as far up the political ladder as possible in
Vietnam to encourage local and state government to look at BSF
technology as a simple and cheap way to avoid the transporting and
landfilling of food waste. We have conducted seminars in Saigon where a
lot of officials have clapped and cheered when presented the benefits of
BSF technology, but up to this point, we have not been successful in
stimulating municiple and state involvement in the promotion and
utilization of BSF technology.

Perhaps, this is where the IOBB and other organizations, who are skilled
in addressing environmental issues on an international level, could make
a big difference. We do not have the political clout needed to grab the
attention of the various levels of government in Vietnam.

>How can we design a project to generate data to show that we can reduce
>the number of trips to the landfill ? We know that it will reduce the
>volume of wastes but does this means also the reduction of trips ?

I have already answered some of the above question in my last e-mail.
Vietnamese foods contains a lot more cellulose and liquids than US
foods. Therefore, the US figure of a 95% reduction in weight and volume
does not apply. Until studies are done to determine the amount of
cellulose in Vietnamese foods and the amount of coconut husk or some
other absorbent biomass that would have to be added on average to
Vietnamese foods, it will be difficult to say how often the
bioconversion units would have to be emptied.

My guess would be about once every 8 to 12 months. No doubt, Dr. Tran
Tan Viet is far better equipped to make an estimate in this regard than
I. In any case, we know that the transport of highly putrescent food
waste would be eliminated altogether, and that the transport of BSF
residue would be minimal. As a entomologist and botanist, no one is
better equipped than Dr. Viet in finding a commercial home for BSF
residue. Instead of transporting BSF residue to a landfill, it could be
transported to a centralized processing facility to transform it into a
growing medium for orchids and other tropical plants.

What do BSF larvae secrete into their residue that inhibits the growth of fungi?

Therefore, I suggest that the IOBB organize and fund a study that would
address the following issues:

1) the average cellulose and moisture content of Vietnamese foods;
2) the average amount of liquid-absorbent biomass that must be added to
Vietnamese foods to assure aerobic conditions and optimal BSF feeding
within the bioconversion unit;
3) the best liquid-absorbent material (coconut husk, bagasse and so
forth) to use in Vietnamese food waste bioconversion;
4) the average reduction in weight and volume of Vietnamese foods;
5) the characterization of BSF prepupae and residue;
6) commerical evaluation of BSF prepupae and residue in local and
international markets.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 65
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:15:39 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Paul Olivier wrote:
>If live-food for reptiles and tropical fish sells in
>the United States for more $4.00 per pound, perhaps
>there are speciality markets that the production of
>BSF prepupae could address.

Pet shops could be one of your target users of your bioconversion units.
Their shops  generate a good amount of animal and bird droppings and all
these could be converted on-site into live-bait for their reptiles,
mice, and birds !

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 66
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:49:50 +0100
Subject:      IOBB - project proposals
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Paul Olivier
>Perhaps, this is where the IOBB and other organizations,
>who are skilled in addressing environmental issues on
>an international level, could make a big difference. .....(cut)...
>Therefore, I suggest that the IOBB organize and fund
>a study that would address the following issues:

I certainly hope that IOBB will be able to develop a project proposal to
incorporate some of the issues raised during this e-seminar and to seek
answers for them.

One information that I would like to get is the cost of transporting
garbage from a specific city (in a developing country) to its nearest
dump site. Any help on this would be appreciated.

Regards
Jacky E.L. Foo, Chairman,
IOBB (Intl Org for Biotechnology and Bioengineering)
Web: http://www.biotech.kth.se/iobb

>>> Posting number 67
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:56:55 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo  wrote
>Pet shops could be one of your target users of your
>bioconversion units. Their shops  generate a good
>amount of animal and bird droppings and all
>these could be converted on-site into live-bait for
>their reptiles, mice, and birds !

Along similar lines, there is a company called Fluker Farms here in
Louisiana that has shown great interest in BSF bioconversion. See
http://www.flukerfarms.com/
Please note the prices at which crickets, wax worms, meal worms, etc are
sold. Fluker Farms could market large quantities of BSF prepupae.

Thanks.
Paul Olivier
ESR LLC
www.esrla.com

>>> Posting number 68
Date:         Sat, 6 Mar 2004 17:56:55 +0100
Subject:      BSF in warm countries
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo asked
>If the air temperature 40 Celcius and a 2-foot bioconversion
>unit is not under direct sun, what are the risks in getting
>an overheated unit with dead larvae ?

Under the conditions you describe above, there is a limit on how many
BSF larvae can occupy a square foot or square meter of disposal unit
surface. I have never observed larvae that have died through
overheating. Generally they crawl out of the unit long before this happens.

Overheating limits the number of larvae in a unit, but even under the
warmest summer or tropical conditions, I have always observed sufficient
numbers of larve to handle the amount of food waste deposited into a
unit. Under warm summer conditions, it may take from 12 to 24 hours for
the larvae to digest the maximum input of food waste, whereas during the
cool of fall or winter, this time is reduced to an hour or two.

>I understand that the collection bucket will prevent larvae from
>escaping which reduces the risk of larvae crawling all over
>the kitchen floor.

I would not suggest that the BSF disposal unit be housed in a kitchen.
When overheating occurs in a unit, the collection bucket is quickly
filled with actively feeding larvae, and not the prepupae one would
normally expect. It is easy to transfer these heat-stressed larvae to
another disposal unit where overheating has not occurred. Eventually the
numbers of actively feeding larvae within a disposal unit self-adjust
and self-regulate.

>Slide 83:
> >Paradoxically it would appear that BSF disposal
> >units function far better in winter than in summer.
>
>How would you change the design for warm countries ?

The units function better in winter than in summer, but their
performance in summer is still quite impressive and fully adequate. To
increase summer performance, the units could be placed in a large pan of
water, and cool water could be continually circulated through this pan.
This might reduce the number of units required for a given amount of
food waste. But the cost of such a cooling system would have to be less
than the cost of buying additional bioconversion units.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
519 West Dejean Street
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 69
Date:         Sun, 7 Mar 2004 20:23:15 +0100
Subject:      BSF in warm countries
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Paul Olivier
>Under warm summer conditions, it may take from
>12 to 24 hours for the larvae to digest the maximum
>input of food waste, whereas during the cool of fall
>or winter, this time is reduced to an hour or two.

Temperature inside the bin is therefore a very important factor in the
waste conversion process (and consequently the growth of the larvae).

Slide 58
>This tropical fly larva needs to be sustained at
>temperatures above 30°C.
>....as the temperature drops below 21°C, their uability
>to digest waste progressively grinds to a halt, and if they
>should freeze, they die.

Has temperature in the substrate been monitored in Vietnam ?

Slide 66
>The difference in temperature between inside and
>outside the unit can exceed at times 82°F or 45° C.

This probably mean that the substrate is composting and thus the heat
generation. This is why when I worked with brewery spent grains, I use a
layer of 15 cm of substrate only. When the spent grains are heaped into
a pile, in inner part of the heap is so hot that housefly maggots move
to the top surface layer.

What is the maximum depth of substrate that the 2-foot base unit ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 70
Date:         Mon, 8 Mar 2004 07:15:01 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: Paul Totterdell <S_O_Solutions@netspeed.com.au>

Paul Totterdell wrote:
>...I believe that Paul Olivier's system of BSF larvae
>supplemented by incidental decomposition by worms, bacteria, and a
>myriad of other undescribed microbes represents a very powerful
>recycling system.

Paul Olivier replied:
>Nothing in nature can rival the power of BSF larvae
>to dispose of putrescent waste, but it will not be an easy
>task for these larvae to gain social and cultural acceptance.

"R. Ansell" responded:
>This is bang on.
>However there is a cloud on the horizon that has come
>more to the fore recently with the discovery of the
>2 cases of BSE and that is traceability and purity of
>feed for livestock.
Cut.....
>(Remember the recent scare over apparently 'high' level
>of pcb's in farmed salmon as a result of concentration
>through the feed processing - the science wasn't
>particularly rigorous but it was picked up by the
>media and is now out in the public domain)
Cut.....
>It will be critical, therefore, that any animal feed produced
>from BSF larvae has traceability and that the larvae do
>not concentrate toxins or other undesireables that may
>be present in only trace quantities in the waste to be consumed.

This cloud has at least one and possibly many silver linings. In order
to address contamination I believe we need to first split the problem
into two categories, chemical contamination and biological contamination.

Chemical Contamination

Chemical contamination is a problem we need to closely monitor. It is
inevitable that some contamination will be present in every recycling
situation BSF based or otherwise. A large part of the problem is not
being aware of a certain contaminants presence. Our industrial world has
injected such a volume and so many new molecules and unnaturally
redistributed so many elements into the environment that contamination
however dilute is inevitable in any organic waste.  Identifying all of
them and the working out the emergent properties of any given mix of
contamination is a huge task. Perhaps an impossible task if
contamination only exists in a dilute form in our organic wastes and our
waste fluids.

If we apply Paul Olivier's unique approach to problem wastes this
contamination of BSF represents an invaluable learning opportunity.

If BSF larvae accumulate and concentrate contaminants Does this not
represent a cleaning of the waste making it safer to be used in ongoing processes.

If heavy metals accumulate in the fat of BSF larvae this in itself
represents a filtering (cleaning the waste) and concentration of that
heavy metal in a neat little package to be identified and possibly
recycled or at least rendered safe.

If by its presence in every household BSF larvae identify dangerous
contaminants I believe the consumer world will Jump at the chance to
stop buying those products that are bringing these contaminants into
their homes. This in turn would force producers to modify their
behaviour or risk losing their market.

In our work with water recycling one of our strategies is to concentrate
contaminants in the bottom of specially designed subsurface drainage
channels. This removes the contaminants from input water and allows
clean water to flow on. The concentrated contamination presents an
opportunity to study a problem that has previously been very difficult
to study due to the fact that contamination of water is normally
extremely dilute in our local waterways. By studying the concentrate we
can identify the contaminants more easily. By studying the microbes and
bugs that invade this concentrate we can begin to identify natural
processes that break down molecules into their component parts (Elements).

All human activity is part of a living environment that needs all of the
elements to build its life forms. As elements are slowly drawn out of
the concentrate by the action of bacteria, microbes, bugs, fungi and
plants, any element that is not being used up as fast as it is being
introduced will begin to build up and become apparent in our testing.
The source of the excess can be identified and products or practices can
be modified to remove it.

BSF are a part of this system. There will be some contaminants that BSF
larvae render safe. A BSF unit model can be marketed as a solution to
that contamination, whilst providing a food source.

There will be some contaminants that accumulate within the BSF larvae.

A range BSF unit models can be marketed as an indicator units and
collection and recycling of the contaminant itself along with the
already identified useful compounds that can be recovered from BSF larvae.

One popular criticism of this approach is that it keeps this
contamination close to the site where the waste was created and this
makes the residents of that site nervous.

As people become more concerned about their environment the advantages
of being able to inform them of exactly what contaminants they are
introducing by their use of certain products and practices becomes a big
plus. Eventually people's health becomes more important to them than any
squeamishness they may feel towards creepy crawlies in general.

"R. Ansell" Wrote:
>We are continually asked by our customers what we feed
>our animals and consequently for any bought in feed we
>demand not only a breakdown of the nutrient components
>but also their source so that we can, for example,  be sure
>that our cattle feed does not contain any animal based protein etc.
>We expect more and more regulation of farming activities,
>as appearing to act decisively on a perceived possible public
>health issue is a sure fire winner for vote hungry politicians.

Paul Totterdell Wrote:
>We too are constantly asked this sort of question in regard
>to recycled water. This market for contamination knowledge
>is an existing market that is under serviced.

'Choice' magazine is a very profitable publication of product
ingredients and active constituents, that caters to this market.

Biological Contamination

Identifying chemical contamination is difficult. Identifying biological
contamination is far more difficult. Constant shifts and mutations of
pathogens in our waste streams, mean that we will never be able to
'Solve' this problem. So far we are falling behind in even
identification of existing life forms. It is possible that we will never
catch up and can merely react when a new health problem arises.

The CSIRO (Commonwealth Scientific Industrial Research Organisation) in
Australia has been doing some interesting research into pathogens in
waste water. In essence they have found that;

"once underground, the disease-causing organisms [in the input
greywater] face a hostile array of conditions such as temperature
changes, lack of oxygen, lack of nutrients and a whole army of
naturally occurring groundwater micro-organisms that kill or
inactivate them." *

* CSIRO Media Release accessed 01/02/02.

The environment that exists within a BSF unit has its own hostile
conditions and army of bugs. The theory is (and so far seems to be
holding up) that if competion for nutrients and habitat is fierce enough
no life forms can build up to dangerous levels.

The logical argument against this is that we are creating an unholy
mixture which (in the words of Bill Bryson) we cannot entirely identify,
whose emergent properties we cannot predict, whose effect on humans we
do not entirely understand and what we do understand we haven't
understood for long.

One answer to this concern is that this unholy mix is currently
accumulating in all areas of our environment (i.e. the bottoms of our
creeks rivers lakes and oceans) and we better start identifying,
understanding and predicting soon.

All of the above suggest to me a few possible variations to BSF unit
model designs  that will take advantage of indicator and filtering functions.

Could we in some cases take advantage of a hostile concentration of
chemical contaminants as part of the treatment of biological
contaminants before removing both from the system?

This message is long enough however so I will wait till design is
brought up as a topic.

 Best Regards
 Paul Totterdell
 Clearwater Environmental Design

>>> Posting number 71
Date:         Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:29:29 +0100
Subject:      BSF in warm countries
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

Jacky Foo asked
>Has temperature in the substrate been monitored in Vietnam ?

I do not recall if temperatures within the BSF bins in Vietnam
have been recorded. This is a question that Dr. Viet can answer.

>This probably mean that the substrate is composting and
>thus the heat generation.

Tom Matthews of Iowa State University has studied the BSF residue within
my bin, and biologically it is relatively inactive. There is no
putrescent matter that bacteria can readily convert to heat. The heat
appears to be generated primarily by the larvae themselves. Thermophilic
bacteria play no role in BSF bioconversion, and even mesophilic bacteria
have little time or opportunity to make an impact in terms of heat generation.

>This is why when I worked with brewery spent grains, I use a
>layer of 15 cm of substrate only. When the spent grains are heaped into
>a pile, in inner part of the heap is so hot that housefly maggots move
>to the top surface layer. What is the maximum depth of substrate
>that the 2-foot base unit ?

The maximum residue depth within the small unit is two feet or about 60 cm.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
ESR LLC
www.esrla.com

>>> Posting number 72
Date:         Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:29:29 +0100
Subject:      2-foot base bioconversion units
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Paul Olivier wrote:
> Along similar lines, there is a company called Fluker Farms here in
> Louisiana that has shown great interest in BSF bioconversion. See
> http://www.flukerfarms.com/
> Please note the prices at which crickets, wax worms, meal worms,
>etc are sold. Fluker Farms could market large quantities of BSF prepupae.

If significant waste cycling begins to occur with  bsf then the prices
seen for insects used for petfood will not hold for bsf. this is a tiny
market compared to the wholesale food animal feedstuff market
where I envision bsf prepupal meal being marketed. $500 per ton
would be wonderful.  The approximately $6-8 per pound for
mealworms for instance, could not be supported.

Regards,
Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.

>>> Posting number 73
Date:         Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:29:29 +0100
Subject:      BSF prepupae as a feedstock for salmon
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

Theo van Kempen wrote
> On paper, BSF have a pretty interesting nutritional composition.
> However, I would be curious to see how well they are digested by
> livestock and species such as Salmon. This since some insect proteins
> (i.e, chitin) are very hard to break down.
>
> Has anybody done any tests on this?

We have lately done a couple of  replicated catfish feeding
studies with pelleted diets containing 8% menhaden fishmeal or
various levels of prepupae meal.  In the most recent test all
prepupae diets produced greater growth than the fishmeal diet and
3 of 4 were statistically superior (p<.1).  the first test was similar,
but cannot remember details. The best diet was the 7.5% prepupae
diet, better than diets w/ more prepupae.  Prepupae are actually
too high in fat for optimum catfish diets and may be well matched to
salmon which need more fat.  I don't think chitin figures in to the
analysis as a protein.  Larry??

Regards,
Craig

Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
PO Box 748, Tifton GA, 31793, USA
Ph (229) 386-3374
Fx (229)386-3086

>>> Posting number 74
Date:         Mon, 8 Mar 2004 23:29:29 +0100
Subject:      Public health issues concerning BSF larvae as feed
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

>Paul Totterdell wrote:
>This cloud has at least one and possibly many silver linings. In order
>to address contamination I believe we need to first split the problem
>into two categories, chemical contamination and biological
>contamination.

It is hard to understand the origin of chemical and biological
contaminants within source-separated food waste. Residential and
restaurant food waste is such a diverse and highly variegated waste that
the accumulation of contaminants appears very unlikely.

However, if BSF bioconversion units are operated on a commercial level,
and they receive a very specific and homogeneous putrescent waste
material, such as orange peelings contaminated with a specific
herbicide, then all that Paul Totterdell has written fully applies and
merits careful consideration.

Thanks.

Paul A. Olivier, Ph.D.
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/

>>> Posting number 75
Date:         Tue, 9 Mar 2004 13:14:24 +0100
Subject:      e-seminar
From: Larry Newton,
E-seminar Chairman [fig@tifton.uga.edu]

Greetings,

This may be an appropriate point to do a short review of the seminar
discussion, and take a look at what seems to be the state of the
technology and needs.

Topics (and in some cases with my additonal comments) include:

(1) The question of developing turnkey systems versus components for
individual use and where or how to
start, as a business proposition -
there does not appear to be a universal answer

(2) The integration of BSF and vermiculture  -
there may be significant advantages;

(3) Potential problems with ants invading BSF cultures are a problem in
some locations -
water traps may be necessary. Mice, rats, and some wildlife may also
consume larvae and prepupae if they have a chance.

(4) The use of BSF for waste treatment at temporary sites, such as
seasonal camps -
the potential seems excellent if eggs or larvae are available and the
people have some level of commitment

(5) The amount of waste consumed and the characteristics of suitable
larvae feed  -
given a suitable time, or an acceptable mixture, most putrescent wastes
are consumed. Moisture content was also discussed, in my experience, dry
materials will be consumed if added to a bed with adequate moisture,
such as spilled feed from swine or poultry falling into a pit.  If feed
or ground grain is wet only to the point that it will become moldy and
very warm, it will not attract or support BSF.  If such material is
wetter, to the extent that it develops a "sour" smell, but does not get
particularly hot, it will soon have a large population of BSF larvae.
This may be critical for some applications.

(6) Repellents and biostatic compounds that are apparently produced in
BSF cultures -
specific compounds have not been identified. Biostatic peptides, as
identified and produced by some other maggots would be good candidates.

(7) The locations of and results from Paul Olivier's bioconversion units
and their availability -
ten units have been made, five are in use and reported to be functioning
well, a greater supply of the units should potentially be available in 6
to 12 months;

(8) How best to supply eggs or young larvae was discussed as well as
centralized or dispersed production -
for long distance shipment, eggs should likely be preferred, there
should likely be a centralized supply for smaller systems, while larger
systems may want to produce their own eggs;

(9) Maintaining a suitable or optimum temperature, along with possible
heating and cooling -
in less than very extreme environments, conserving heat produced within
the culture should provide enough warmth, artificial cooling may be too
expensive in most situations;

(10) Speciality markets for larvae - including exotic pets, fish bait,
and salmon - and the residue - including soil amendments for high value
plants such as orchids -
were suggested as potential niche markets as starting places for
commercialization. A question of coloring the larvae was asked.

(11) There appears to be a great need for additional economic research
or information gathering, including the costs associated with current
practices in developing countries.  The topic that became known as "the
maggot factor", pointed to a real problem.  The aversion to maggots is
widespread, and while it is undoubtedly learned, it was also apparently
easily taught (and possibly not easily unlearned).  The only answer
appears to be education, although it may be a long process.

(12) The feeding of BSF larvae to farm animals, especially pigs and
poultry was a topic -
in backyard or near subsistence farming, it makes sense to feed the
higher quality kitchen and table waste directly to the animals, with the
less digestible material fed to BSF.  Feeding BSF larvae as a supplement
should increase productivity of the animals since BSF concentrate
calcium, they would appear to be especially valuable for egg production.

(13) The question of digestibility was raised.  -
We published the results of a digestion trial with pigs in the Journal
of Animal Science 44:395-400.  The larvae were produced on waste from
steers fed a high grain diet, but their composition was similar to that
of larvae fed poultry or swine manure.  Dried larvae were compared to
soybean meal plus feed grade fat to give similar protein and fat - but
we missed the mark on the fat.  Apparent nitrogen digestibility was
77.2% for soy and 76.0 for BSF diets - close, but P<.05.  Ether extract
apparent digestibility was greater for BSF, calcium was similar for the
two diets, and phosphorus was lower for BSF.  BSF larvae likely have a
more valuable use as a part of the protein supplement rather than the
sole supplement - this would also avoid having a diet that is above 13%
fat.  I can probably find a few reprints if anyone is interested.)

(14) Feeding the larvae to animals destined to produce products for
human consumption elicited potential food safety concerns, including
microbial contamination and bioaccumulation of chemicals or toxins.
Controlling the source of feed for the larvae is one approach, possibly
including analysis and trace back of off-site sourced materials.  Larvae
feeds based on kitchen wastes and typical animal manures would appear to
offer little risk, while industrial processing waste or garbage included
in general household or municipal waste may be suspect.  Larvae fed on
manure appear to accumulate most metal ions to a greater or lesser
extent, with iron being an exception.  Heavy metals have generally been
too low in the larvae feed to determine if there may be a problem.
Source separated materials may be necessary, but even that is difficult
to predict in areas where garbage has traditionally been commingled.
From the standpoint of pathogens, prions, etc. and manure fed larvae, it
may be safest to avoid feeding larvae back to the species that produced
the manure.

(15) In another side to the same question, the possibility of using BSF
as a bioremedial agent of contaminated waste was brought up.  Little, if
any, actual data seems to be available to allow meaningful speculation,
but metals and fat soluble materials would appear to be possibilities.

(16) Several suggested research, demonstration, or commercial projects
have been suggested.  These include:
- processing fruit and vegetable peelings, possibly after recovery of
other materials with value, such as orange oil;
- processing the manure at a miniature pig sanctuary;
- processing food waste  at a school or market place in Uganda;
- processing waste from pet shops;
- and several potential demonstration or commercial systems in Vietnam,
including a project to determine the composition of food and food waste
that might be used as larvae feed.

The idea was expressed that initial projects might have a greater chance
of success if they were located at schools or universities.  Committed
local management with some appropriate experience will likely be a key
factor, whether it is committed because of a desire to help people or
due to financial investment.

The design of specific systems was also mentioned as a topic of
discussion and we may want to develop a list of specific needed
information applicable to future basic or applied research projects.

Thanks,
Larry Newton
Chairman of IOBB e-seminar
Animal & Dairy Science Dept.,
University of Georgia Coastal Plain Station,
Tifton, GA. USA

>>> Posting number 76
Date:         Wed, 10 Mar 2004 08:36:14 +0100
Subject:      Project development
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Thank you Mr. Chairperson for the useful summary which certainly helps
to bring us into the next step of an agenda from information/experience
sharing into the action mode where we can work together to test/apply
this method for waste conversion and minimisation.

As indicated earlier, I wish to develop a network project in developing
countries and therefore welcome you to join. The current idea of the
project is
(1) use of 2-foot conversion units from Paul Olivier and monitor
different practices to generate information for user manual
(2) identify support services that are needed to ensure successful
introduction and use of the technology
(3) integrating the technology with other systems to increase for
sustainability and productivity

Primary and collaborating partners
Primary partners will be those in developing countries and we will have
the research site in your country. Collaborating partners will be those
who will assist in fund raising and/or have laboratory resources that
can do tests/analysis. You can also be involved in the project in a
self-supporting manner as an investigator.
Information needed (where appropriate):
- About yourself (CV),
- your organization,
- past experience,
- your contribution (site or partner raising funds, or access to lab
resources) and give details

(1) Practices and information for user manual :
monitoring of
- feeding rates/weight
- prepupae production
- temperature
- ?

(2) identify support services :
- supply and inoculation of eggs
- ?

(3) integrating the technology with other systems (depending on type of
wastes used):
E.g. BSF-earthworm
BSF-earthworm-poultry system
BSF-earthworm-poultry-small ruminants system

(4) Other issues to be considered
- problems with ants, mice, rats, etc.
- unit design
- use in seasonal camps, boarding schools, others
- screening of high value compounds from larvae (repellents, biostatic
peptides)
- testing speciality markets for live larvae use
- use of digested residue in plant nurseries
- digestibility of prepupae in feed rations
- screening of chemicals, pathogens or toxins in prepupae
- etc.

The above is a range of things to choose that we could pick to do
depending on site or laboratory.

You are welcomed to add more items and provide more ideas.
Declare your intentions if you wish to be involved.

Regards
Jacky Foo

>>> Posting number 77
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:53:35 +0100
Subject:      Project development - Rwanda
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Dear all,

I have missed the beginning of this discussion list and am not able to
participate properly at this point in time. I am about to leave for
Rwanda (this month) together with my wife and am looking forward to join
bsf activities in the "neighbourhood" but have plans of my own, too.

A process engineer by profession, I have spent about 5 years in the
Philippines ('97 to '03) for the German Development Service DED,
managing waste. Jacky Foo invited me to participate in an earlier bsf
discussion list about 2 years ago, I joined then discovered bsf larvae
in my compost heap. I ended up growing bsf for 9 months successfully,
eventually in a netted cage.

Regards,
Anthony Simm

>>> Posting number 78
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 07:56:35 +0100
Subject:      problem of ants
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Mary Appelhof asked
>When you (Paul Olivier) say, " Special precautions
>against the intrusion of ants should be taken."
>What kinds of precautions
>do you find effective, or recommend?

What works o.k. as an obstacle against ants is a layer of petroleum jelly.

Regards,
Anthony Simm

>>> Posting number 79
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:00:42 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

We fed bsf prepupae to young chicken, young hens and roosters in the
Philippines. They gained weight about 15 to 20% faster than the control
group, most probably due to the (unexplained) fact that they eat more.
They may simply have grown fat...no final determination done.

But the roosters were much more vigorous: they won every fight (very
important issue in the Philippines!).

Regards,
Anthony Simm

>>> Posting number 80
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:25:27 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Anthony Simm
>We fed bsf prepupae to young chicken, young hens and
>roosters in the Philippines. ..........
>But the roosters were much more vigorous: they won
>every fight (very important issue in the Philippines!).

Hi Anthony
Nice to have you back.

If you look at slide 63 in http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm
you can imagine the amount of fighting a larvae needs to put up with in
its living environment.

If I was a rooster, I would probably link my winning to eating the
larvae that German white face man persuaded me to eat ?

In this e-discussion, we indicated the need to look for speciality markets.

Could we now imagine that human fighters in the rings for boxing, kick
fighting, wrestlers and other sports be all taking a protein drink that
has BSF protein in it or a shot of BSF extract ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 81
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 08:37:32 +0100
Subject:      Project development - Rwanda
From: Jacky Foo <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Anthony Simm
>I am about to leave for Rwanda (this month) together
>with my wife and am looking forward to join
>bsf activities in the "neighbourhood" but have
>plans of my own, too.

Tell us more about your plans for BSF in Rwanda.

It would be useful to put that in the "network" research proposal for
the introduction of the technology into warm countries and also test
Paul's design of the units.

I am looking for an appropriate funding agency for the grant
application. Has GTZ been sensitized with the BSF larvae production
technology ? Would GTZ be a good place to send this application ?

Regards
Jacky

>>> Posting number 82
Date:         Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:31:22 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

While living in Texas, I fed BSF prepupae to about 25 free-range
chickens each day. These chickens had bowls continually filled with corn
and other feed. But each time I fed them BSF prepupae, regardless of the
quantity presented, these chickens gourged themselves until all was
eaten. They might eat up to 3 kgs per feeding.

Obviously these chickens enjoyed very much the taste of live BSF
prepupae. Ducks and geese also enjoyed live BSF, but far less than
chickens. Turkeys showed very little interest in them.

Thanks.

Paul Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC

>>> Posting number 83
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:20:06 +0100
Subject:      recovery of chitin
From: Uwe Brunjes <ubrunjes@yahoo.com>

Dear listmembers,

In our previous round of discussion somebody mentioned the possibility
of using the chitin of the bsf larvae for other purposes than feed. Is
there a way to get it off their bodies before feeding them to our
"consumers", whoever they are? After all, they don't feel pain, so it
wouldn't be a cruelty, plus we would still be feeding life, moving feed
to those consumers. For some of them, this is very important

Uwe

>>> Posting number 84
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:34:04 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Jacky Foo wrote:
>Could we now imagine that human fighters in the rings
>for boxing, kick fighting, wrestlers and other sports be all
>taking a protein drink that has BSF protein in it or
>a shot of BSF extract?

Nice idea, but even though this kind of spirit with a maggot in it
sells, I am afraid we are facing the "maggot factor" here.
Regards,
Anthony

>>> Posting number 85
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:37:15 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Paul Olivier wrote:
>While living in Texas, I fed BSF prepupae to about 25
>free-range chickens each day. These chickens had bowls
>continually filled with corn and other feed. But each
>time I fed them BSF prepupae, regardless of the
>quantity presented, these chickens gourged themselves
>until all was eaten. They might eat up to 3 kgs per feeding.
>
>Obviously these chickens enjoyed very much the taste
>of live BSF prepupae. Ducks and geese also enjoyed live
>BSF, but far less than chickens. Turkeys showed very little
>interest in them.

So it was like with the chicken in the Phils. They would eat more of
their standard crumbs etc., as if the prepupae worked as an appetizer.

I did see turkeys eat and apparently like them, too.

But ducks went completely berserk about them and made a lot of noise and
ran around, wild, after finishing the quantity I had on me when I fed them.

Regards,
Anthony

>>> Posting number 86
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:40:44 +0100
Subject:      Project development
From: "Craig Sheppard" <sheppard@tifton.uga.edu>

From Newton and Sheppard:

Dear Bioconversion Seminar Participants,

We support and encourage bsf projects in developing countries, but we
will not be able to participate directly, due to other commitments.
These commitments include efforts to develop and demonstrate bsf systems
for manure management on US commercial farms. Assisting commercial 
agriculture is a primary mission of our college.  We could also agree to 
assist with reviewing or other tasks in developing a handbook.

In any case we will continue to exchange information with you as we have
been doing. This is beneficial to the science and we will continue to
contribute whenever  we can be helpful and it is appropriate.

Drs. Larry Newton and Craig Sheppard
University of Georgia, CPES
Tifton GA 31793
+++
Craig Sheppard, Ph.D.
Dept. of Entomology
UGA Coastal Plain Expt. Sta.
PO Box 748, Tifton GA, 31793, USA
Ph (229) 386-3374
Fx (229)386-3086

>>> Posting number 87
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 08:43:18 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: CAVM@aol.com

Anthony and Paul,

Were both of you feeding live BSF larvae?
What do you suppose would be the recommended rate in poultry feed?

I am thinking of Craig's recommendation that fish feed should include
not more than 8% dried larvae.

How do poultry take to the dried product?

Someone did a study some time ago showing that poultry did very well on
a diet of earthworms and zuchini (I am happy to let the birds have my
share).

Neal Van Milligen
Kentucky Enrichment Inc
www.kentuckyenrichment.com

>>> Posting number 88
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 17:17:24 +0100
Subject:      IOBB - project proposals
From: "Charles Twesigye" <cktwesigye@mulib.mak.ac.ug>

Jacky,
> I certainly hope that IOBB will be able to develop a project
>proposal to incorporate some of the issues raised during
>this e-seminar and to seek answers for them.
>
> One information that I would like to get is the cost of transporting
> garbage from a specific city (in a developing country) to its nearest
> dump site. Any help on this would be appreciated.

I will get you information on the cost of transporting garbage from
Mukono City  and Kampala City in Uganda in a week's time from today.

Charles K. Twesigye
Kyambogo University

>>> Posting number 89
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 17:17:24 +0100
Subject:      Project development
From: Paul Totterdell <S_O_Solutions@netspeed.com.au>

newton and sheppard wrote:
>These commitments include efforts to develop and
>demonstrate bsf systems for manure management on US
>commercial farms.

i too believe that the commercial aspect of BSF decomposition is the
more pressing need in the short term. (ie the next few years). Solving
nutrient outflows from commercial animal product producers is emerging
as a major environmental issue that is more urgent than domestic
recycling at this point in time. Given that this is true (and i am open
to argument) applying BSF technology to intense farming systems should
be our priority.

Regards
Paul Totterdell

>>> Posting number 90
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 17:19:09 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>
 

Neal Van Milligen asked
>Were both of you feeding live BSF larvae?

I fed live larvae to these 25 free-range chickens.

>What do you suppose would be the recommended rate in poultry feed?

I have no idea. All that I can say is that the chickens showed a strong
preference for live larvae over and against all other feed presented to them.

>How do poultry take to the dried product?

I have no idea.

Thanks.
Paul A. Olivier

>>> Posting number 91
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:05:36 +0100
Subject:      Project development - Rwanda
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Jacky Foo wrote:
>I am looking for an appropriate funding agency for
>the grant application. Has GTZ been sensitized
>with the BSF larvae production technology ?
>Would GTZ be a good place to send this application ?

I believe GTZ funds LEAD who host some bsf material though that doesn't
mean anybody there is maggot sensitive :-)

Have you thought of PPP?

In principle every German state funded development aid organization
should have a PPP approach. For details on PPP please check the GTZ or
BMZ website.

By the way it is DED not GTZ who we go to Rwanda for.

Regards,
Anthony
GTZ - http://www.gtz.de/
LEAD - http://www.lead.org
BMZ - http://www.bmz.de/
DED - http://www.ded.de

>>> Posting number 92
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:05:36 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Anthony Simm <anthony_simm@WEB.DE>

Neal asked
>Were both of you feeding live BSF larvae?

Yes we were feeding live bsf in the Philippines plus local standard "crumbs".

>What do you suppose would be the recommended rate in poultry feed?
>I am thinking of Craig's recommendation that fish feed should include
>not more than 8% dried larvae.

A question of mathematics; chicken need so and so much protein (19 to
21% I think) and it must be of an appropriate amino acid composition.
Simply diluting the 42% protein down to size with carbohydrates wouldn't
suffice, as you end up with a still high fat content and probably with
an inappropriate amino acid breakdown. So you will need some slack for adjustment.

Estimate: 20% for the bsf share in the feeds, maximum?
Not sure. I am an engineer, is there someone here who can help?

>How do poultry take to the dried product?

No idea.

Regards,
Anthony

>>> Posting number 93
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:05:36 +0100
Subject:      Project development
From: "Larry Newton" <fig@tifton.uga.edu>

Greetings,
Many of you may already be aware of these resources, but I attempted to
take a look at possible funding sources for a BSF international project.

One place to look may be: www.grantsmanagement.com/links.html
There are several listings under the International Funders heading.

Also, New England Biolabs Foundation (www.nebf,org/index.html) funds
projects in Vietnam, Cambodia, and several other countries.

Thanks,
Larry

>>> Posting number 94
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:08:07 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: Larry Newton [fig@tifton.uga.edu]

Neal and Paul,

Otho Hale fed dried BSF larvae to chicks as a replacement  for soybean
meal in a complete diet (diet were either 35% soy meal or 35% dried
larvae).  The larvae were raised on a mixture of manure and spoiled pig feed.

During a 14 day test, gain was 112.6g and 107.7g for soy and bsf,
respectively.  Feed intake was 7.46 and 6.97 (P<.05) while feed gain was
1.64 and 1.62, for soy and BSF, respectively.  The BSF diet was higher 
in most essential amino acids, but some were higher in the soy diet.

This information is published in J. Georgia Entomological Soc. 8:16-20
(1973).  Additional work, with various percentages of BSF is needed.

Thanks,
Larry

>>> Posting number 95
Date:         Fri, 12 Mar 2004 21:39:30 +0100
Subject:      Project development - BSF-chicken system
From: "Theo van Kempen" <t_vankempen@ncsu.edu>

Actually, a more fundamental approach would be much better. Figure out
what the digestibility is of the various components in BSF, and then
formulate diets accordingly and test if they work as foreseen, or if
there is a magic factor in BSF larvae. These are standard assays that
many of the poultry nutrition labs can carry out quite easily. This also
allows one to calculate a dollar value for the product based on local
feedstuff market conditions.

Also, keep in mind that commercial poultry diets are processed, and high
oil contents in such diets negatively affect processing ability. Other
issues to keep in mind are that fat quality affects bird quality, a BIG
issue for commercial producers.

Theo

>>> Posting number 96
Date:         Sat, 13 Mar 2004 12:53:47 +0100
Subject:      Bird Flu
From: "Paul Olivier" <xpolivier@hotmail.com>

When in Vietnam during the month of January 04, bird flu was a big topic
on the news in Saigon. A television interview was held with a Japanese
medical expert who stated that the bird flu was transmitted primarily
through chickens eating spilt food that came into contact with their waste.

I am not sure if this was translated correctly, or if this medical
expert was simply stating his opinion among many other theories
regarding the transmission of this disease.

If this is the case, why not raise the chickens off the floor by
situating them on a PVC-coated wire mesh through which their waste and
any spilt feed might fall?

BSF larvae could be situated underneath the wire mesh and could consume
the waste as fast as it would be produced. Also, in this way, the
concept of chicken
litter would completely disappear.

Thanks.

Paul A. Olivier
Engineering, Separation & Recycling LLC
519 West Dejean Street
Washington, Louisiana 70589
Tel 1-337-826-5540
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm

>>> Posting number 97
Date:         Sat, 13 Mar 2004 19:18:36 +0100
Subject:      Bird Flu
From: "Larry Newton" <fig@tifton.uga.edu>

Paul,
It is my impression that bird flu is transmitted by inhalation of
aerosol droplets or contact with respiratory secretions of an infected
bird, followed by transfer to mouth, eyes, or nose  (or infected human -
apparent route for health care workers in Hong Kong).  So, feed spilled
from a bird's mouth would probably contain the virus.  There is a
discussion of bird flu and the H5N1 virus (hosted in Hong Kong) at:
http://www.hkbws.org.hk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=WildBirdAndAvianFlu;
action=display;num=1078294286

Also, the poultry site has many articles posted (you can get there
from the home page - first part of address).
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/LatestNews/Default.asp?AREA=LatestNews&Display=6187

I am certainly no expert, but it would seem that a mesh floor might slow
the initial spread to a greater or lesser extent, until or unless the
birds reached a sneezing/coughing stage.

Thanks,
Larry

>>> Posting number 98
Date:         Sat, 13 Mar 2004 20:17:06 +0100
Subject:      Seminar Closing
From: Larry Newton [mailto:fig@tifton.uga.edu]

Greetings,

I hope that you feel as I do, that this has been an interesting and
informative e-seminar.  Many of the problems and opportunities have been
highlighted.  Even though the need for additional information and
research is clear, enough understanding of BSF is available that the
technology is currently usable.

The success of one or more projects that demonstrate the usefulness of
BSF culture on management of putrescent wastes, including economic
and/or environmental measurements, could greatly advance the acceptance
of the process (in spite of the maggot factor).  It is my hope that 
such a project(s) will result from our discussion.

In that regard, all participants of the e-seminar will be automatically
added into the IOBB e-forum (et-jizo@segate.sunet.se) on "Black Soldier
Fly and Waste Recycling/Management" (http://segate.sunet.se/archives/et-jizo.html). 
Please continue to report any new observations as well as offer your ideas, suggestions,
and encouragement, as some members of the group develop proposals and projects.

On behalf of the participants, I offer our sincere appreciation and
thanks to Paul Olivier for his leadership of this e-seminar, and to
Jacky Foo, for his time and efforts in editing - which kept the
discussions and messages manageable.

Thank you - and Thanks to All for your participation, we hope that you
will join other IOBB seminars and programs in the future.

Larry Newton
E-seminar Chairman
Animal & Dairy Science Dept.,
University of Georgia Coastal Plain Station,
Tifton, GA. USA
[fig@tifton.uga.edu]

>>> Posting number 99
Date:         Sat, 13 Mar 2004 21:30:41 +0100
Subject:      Seminar Closing
From: Jacky Foo, IOBB <foo@stockholm.bostream.se>

Thank you Mr. Chairperson for your assistance in chairing this very
interesting e-seminar which is also the first IOBB special activity this
year. I am very pleased to see such an interactive session and I can
feel the very supportive atmosphere that we had during the seminar. I
sincerely hope that this will lead to further implementation of projects on BSF 
prepupae production as well as the use of insect larvae for waste management.

I will certainly look forward to the production of the bioconversion
units in Vietnam and personally hope to use of such units one day. I
thank Paul Olivier for generously sharing his knowledge and experience
as well as the design of his commercial units.

I take this opportunity to thank the audience for your questions and
comments that added to our common knowledge on this topic. Some of you
may have joined this e-seminar out of general interest and I hope you
have learnt something more about the opportunity to use insect larvae
for waste management. We need to change the conventional approach for
the management of wastes from "just collection and disposal" into an
integrated and productive waste management. This approach will  enable
us to generate new products from under-utilised resources which we now
call "wastes".   BSF bioconversion is one the the bio-technologies.

IOBB will organize more e-seminars on bio-recycling of wastes and look
forward to more presentors of such seminars. As a token of IOBB's
gratitude, Paul Olivier will receive a free IOBB annual membership the
next year.  So if you are also interested to give an e-seminar or get a
free IOBB membership for 2005, please contact me.

Thank you again for your particition.

Regards
Jacky E.L. Foo, Chairman,
IOBB (Intl Org for Biotechnology and Bioengineering)
Web: http://www.biotech.kth.se/iobb